Or are passive aggressive insinuations the only thing on the menu today?

way to get yourself shot. Actually think it happened last week, but don’t remember where.

what I remember reading.

Last edited Wed Sep 3, 2025, 11:09 AM - Edit history (1)

and I imagine the shooter would have reported such an imminent threat when police took his statement. In any event, it seems that the home occupant was lying in wait for those kids to return and shot the child in the back when he had already fled 20 yards from the house and was no longer an immediate threat.

Kicked and "kicked-in" are different... but hopefully if there was evidence of ANY type of aggressive and threatening kicking rather than just a "ring-and-run" prank it will show up. If it's the former, I imagine that surging adrenaline and the rush of the fight instinct will affect one's ability to think clearly. It seems unlikely that silly "ring-and-run" pranks would result in the kind of fear (rage?) that resulted in his tragic death. But it all remains to be seen.

Thankfully we have a doorbell cam along with a dozen other outdoor cams that will alert us if/when someone approaches... or that can document what happens/ed.

But I can assure you, the defense would not want me on a jury. This by all reports was a fleeing 11-year-old *child* who had already gotten 20 yards away and was no longer a threat. It would take a *lot* of physical evidence to convince me otherwise.

Was laying in wait in the bushes. He had the opportunity to go outside and lay in wait for when they returned. He also had the chance while hiding and watching to see they were little kids.

Instead of calling the police or marching them back to their parents he opted to take chase and shoot a little kid in the back.

By the time the defense is done that little guy will be turned into a high ranking leader of the Latin Kings who asserts dominance by doing tik tok challenges.

“Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, hasn’t the defendant suffered enough?”

Scared. He was a fraidy cat.

But it goes a long way to explaining the mindset of someone who has been (or is being) terrorized and tormented. Fear and anger and rage and adrenaline are not conducive to deliberate and meditative and rational thinking. Wouldn't you agree?

I was trying to understand why you posted them. And even if this was a factor, there are solutions without murder. Are we to be less horrified if it was a door kick incident? My door actually was kicked in when my house was robbed. I secured my door better and didn’t buy or take a gun, even though my entire gun-loving family pressured me to. Am I stupid for that? Do you understand the mindset that looks for alternatives that don’t end in death?

* and it was more of an opportunistic way for someone to take cheap shots at me. In fact, the very last question asked of me (above) is a rather backhanded way of insinuating that such a simple concept is beyond my ability to comprehend. Sigh. Oh well... bye.

Does the activity put the door knocker at enhanced risk for getting shot? Absolutely.

The obvious conclusion is it’s probably a bad idea. Especially in a country with 400 million guns floating around the general population.

Rather old outer screen door glass insert held but frame was bent. Luckily we still could order a new frame for about $80. Glass could have shattered and severed kicker's femoral artery with fatal result.

going up to front doors and kicking in the screen door panels at houses along my street. I wouldn't have sh*t anyone, but the vandalism costs money to repair, and it's usually not enough for insurance to cover it. This was about 10 years ago.

If I had done such a thing as a kid -and my folks found out about it- I would have been skinned alive, then forced to pay repairs.

If I had done that as a kid, I would have been in the same boat as you plus without privileges AND on the prayer list of every evangelical church in the Upland South. But I would have been *alive* to tell the tale.

It's a variation of ringing the doorbell and running away. Which we also have.

It's annoying and can be frightening, but doesn't justify chasing a little kid and shooting him in the back.

It takes a village to raise kids. When I was a child we used to prank phone call people at random. One day an older woman shamed me by saying there was sickness in their house. I never did it again.

I wonder how things might have turned out if the man in the house had opened the door and talked to the kid. Even yelling at him would have been preferable to, you know, shooting him in the back.

Kids do dumb things because they're kids. As adults we're supposed to guide and correct them, not let our lizard brains take over.

A million times—thank you for your (as usual) reasoned and compassionate take, yardwork. Rec!

I am touched.

It may "take a village" but it starts with parenting, without a good foundation to build on, what a village can accomplish is limited. It seems reasonable to guess that the parenting (or lack thereof) would also be one of those "you can't tell MY child what to do" type of people... or the "we negotiate with our children and let them make their own decisions" type of parenting philosophy.

I think it also seems unrealistic that the child would have responded positively (or even heard him) if the man had given him a stern talking-to as he was running away. My best guess is that yelling would have only been essentially to reward the kid with type of reaction he was seeking.

What a tragic ending. Maybe new will spread and parents will pay closer attention to what their free-range children are doing... and who they hang with. Or the "kids" will become aware that this type of aggressive and threatening behavior comes with great risk.

Let's hope that something positive comes from it all.

I haven't seen any evidence that this eleven year old child's parents were neglectful. It's summer, days are long, kids do dumb things.

I don't assume that this child was any more immune to being corrected by adults than I was. Unfortunately nobody will ever know.

Shooting a small child in the back as they run away is never justifiable, ever.

Let's be realistic. Aggressive and repeated donkey-kicking of someone's door is really not comparable to ring-and-run pranks of my generation. The latter is a silly annoyance, the former is perceived as a legitimate threat or a precursor to an actual intruder. Not excusing... just pointing out the difference.

No one said he was "immune" to being corrected, only that he clearly had NOT been in his home life and that the opportunity to "correct him" (by the homeowner while the act was taking place) seems to be an unrealistic expectation. That's all I'm trying to say.

Apparently there is video of him just ringing the doorbell. See the link in post 18

Tnx

I was just thinking of the seventies when I was a kid (elementary school age). Not only did we do prank calls, but it was common to "TP" houses, which involved wrapping toilet paper around all the trees and anything else not tied down on the property. Then there was "egging" houses, which I guess is self explanatory. I never participated in the TPing or the egging, but it was pretty common, and pretty much tolerated. It certainly didn't cause anyone to shoot the perpetuators. For some reason, I never heard of ding dong ditch back then, but it sounds relatively mild in comparison.

You have no clue as to this child's home life, none, so why make such assumptions.

Look, was the kid young and dumb, doing the young and dumb things all kids, including you and I, do. Yes. As a parent you teach them, give them life lessons, and hope the kid remembers them and uses them to guide their behavior. But the frank truth of the matter is that a kid will, at some point, do something dumb. This is part of growing up, learning and exploring life. As a parent you just hope and pray that when that time comes your kid isn't seriously hurt or injured.

In the spectrum of dumb things kids do this is, normally rather benign. Sadly this man was not normal, and had a gun, and an innocent kid died.

It seems to me that throughout this thread you're trying to shift some, if not all, of the blame onto the kid. Why?

And yes, they all do something dumb at some point. You may not see it, you may not hear about it, in fact if there were no negative repercussions you probably won't even know about it. It is part of the child's development and learning. It can be something fairly benign, sneaking out of the house, making a jump that's a little too high, etc. But all kids do it anyway. If a kid doesn't do things like that, their childhood is a bit dull, and they really don't learn the boundaries of their limitations.

I didn't do it.
My friends didn't.
My brother and his friends didn't.
My kids didn't. Not their friends.
My grandkids would be horrified at the thought.
It does have something to do with how you're raised, and taught to respect people.
It sounds like that "boys will be boys" junk.

In case it's not clear, this is not to excuse the cretin who shot the kid.

Never did anything to test your limits? Never risked life and/or limb on some stupid stunt?

I have trouble believing that, but if that is indeed the case, you and yours had a very dull childhood.

Difference between testing limits and risk vs. things that are crappy to others.
And why would you think everything that isn't risky is dull? Kind of narrow viewpoint.

Comes from talking to them and listening to them.
You build that relationship and it pays off.

while yet laying a silent claim to that very reality.

"In a new interview with CBS News, police said Julian and a cousin rang the doorbell two times before, but it was the third time that led to the shooting"
snip
" Authorities said Julian was running down a sidewalk away from Leon's home when he was shot. KHOU 11 News learned that there's video that shows them ringing the doorbell and running away before the shots rang out."
https://www.khou.com/article/news/crime/ding-dong-ditch-shooting-houston-texas-murder-charge/285-f3d7b4ea-0d55-4e95-9904-94fa9a852fe1

This was a man, filled with rage with poor impulse control. Apparently he first fired a warning shot into the ground. If that had been as far as it went, all would have been well. He might have been charged with illegally firing a gun, but given the circumstances I doubt it, especially in Texas. Instead he drew down and shot an innocent kid who was running away multiple times in the back. That's murder, plain and simple. There are no extenuating circumstances, just a man with a gun and a soul filled rage. Lock him up for the rest of his life.

And some are armed with paint ball guns.
I would think the kid with the paint ball gun could be putting himself in harm's way.

The kids who are violently kicking doors, could get themselves in trouble, But LE is often too busy to do anything about minor vandalism these days.

Well, if I hear kicking at my door, it may just be a group of kids. Not the smartest way to get your kicks. "Let's pretend we're home invaders". It's good that the media is informing the public, so some kid doesn't get shot. I noticed that two youths were arrested (They really didn't look particularly youthful either)



I don't think the poor kid was engaged in that type of behavior and he had left.
I wish the homeowner would have just come out and yelled, "Get off of my lawn!!"

... how someone responds. Not defending, just explaining, Kaleva.

Hunker down in the designated safe room and call 911.

... not living in the terror of the moment. I offer this as an example for realistic reflection, not as an excuse for the homeowner's ambush. Hopefully other ding-dongers and kick-and-runners will think twice about the possible deadly consequences of harassing and tormenting homeowners.

The purpose of training is so one can react decisively even in a highly stressful situation and not be overcome by fear and thus very greatly increasing the chance of making some very bad decisions.

When I was a foolish young man some of the more terrifying moments of my life were surprise invasions of my personal space by the police.

Maybe you think I should have shot them?

Yeah, that would have made them "think twice."

Because he waited outside for them to come back. He could have called 911. Seems like he just wanted to shoot them. The monster thought he'd get away with it, self defense? So nuts. You don't wait outside for them to come back with your gun cause you're scared.

We are not the police

If they are a threat to you or your family. That of course can easily escalate, but you can absolutely hold a gun on someone you don’t intend to kill.

The question is, should one do that though. If I’m aiming a gun at someone, it’s because it’s a situation where lethal force is justified. I, or someone else, is in imminent danger of being killed or seriously injured. If I’m not in a situation where lethal force is justified, then I’ll follow the basic rules of gun safety.

All I can think is he didn't have to shoot him. Waiting outside was an ambush. Somehow in his twisted brain he felt justified.

Safe and easy lethality from a distance. We have too much of it around. There's something not sane about it.

People with a gun sometimes take actions that they wouldn’t if they weren’t armed. Actions that increase the risk of harm to themselves or other innocents. Proper training can minimize that.

Not sure why we're suddenly correlating the two here.

Unless I hear the words "we've got a warrant" you're meeting hot lead.

Dont wanna die? Don't cross my threshold, even with your foot.

Sorry, but these are the times we live in. I dont know who is coming through. They could be a fake ICE goon squad coming for my family...

Play stupid games. Win stupid prizes.

... Or who have dealt with unknown intruders, will know and understand that type of abject fear. -- The "stupid games" analogy some things up well, even if it's incorrectly perceived by others as being dismissive. Indeed, these are the times we live in. It's definitely a tragedy, but maybe some other dumb kids will hear about it and learn a lesson that will save their own lives someday. Time will tell, we can only hope.

This was never a thread about finding the truth of the matter. You haven’t been willing to hear the answer. You seem to think somehow the police and reporters are withholding exonerating information. I don’t know how any member of DU is going to answer your question if you aren’t satisfied with the public information. It seems that the thread is more about raw fear or anger ameliorating if not justifying homicide. That’s why the three videos hoping to prime us with a bit of fear annd anger before the discussion even started.
You said “Hopefully other ding-dongers and kick-and-runners will think twice about the possible deadly consequences of harassing and tormenting homeowners.” No mention of hopes that armed homeowners think twice about a possible murder conviction before shooting a 11 year old running from your home?

Anyone is free to "mention" whatever they feel is missing or propose ideas and theories that have not been covered to their personal satisfaction. It's a mistake to make ugly insinuations about others because they failed to, or neglected to, mirror someone else's opinions.

It’s okay if it’s about you. It’s your thread. You say it’s not about you, but your entire response to my post was about you. Like you, I am free to express ideas and theories I have. You’re the one who put your ideas and theories out there. What are we to do with them other than engage? Why the intellectual contortions to continue your narrative without engaging with either facts or views that don’t mirror your own? It’s so easy to engage others in discussion by going point by point or at least engaging some point.

Have a nice day.

Considering the times we live in, everyone should have one. And reinforced doors.

... if you get my meaning.

But I should probably let you know that asking someone the the same question again and again and again could be misinterpreted as bullying or harassment.

You should make that clear in your OP.

One doesn’t need such training if they don’t own a gun or guns but it’s imperative that those who do get the training and then regularly practice that training.

I’m just trying to find out what your expertise is on this issue.

Again, where did you get your training on the use of guns for home defense?

Considering how dangerous guns are and the undisputed fact that lack of training has lead to death or injury of innocents, it’s imperative that gun owners hold themselves to a high standard.

You are free to believe otherwise.

This bizarre level of irrelevant "curiosity" (or prolonged assumption-making) reveals much. It's odd to me when anyone persistently starts asking things about me that are literally none of their business. It's also curious how someone would try to pretend that if I do not answer the intrusive questions to their satisfaction, then they would feel free to make the most negative assumptions in an effort to somehow "disqualify" me. Or, to be dismissive and to cast doubts on the validity of my answers, observations, experiences and... opinions. It's borderline harassment and bullying. Nice try. I'm not playing that game. Sorry. Bye, Kaleva.

You asked a question in your OP. A question you’d know the answer to if you had proper training.

Bye!

You’d know the answer to your question you asked in your OP if you had training.

A responsible and trained gun owner , knowing that kids are doing this stupid prank, would take steps to minimize a tragedy from happening.

Which camp do you support?

Ding dong ditch was being played in our town two years ago. I had to intervene between an irate elderly woman and two little boys. You know what Marjorie (elderly woman did NOT do?). She didn't pull out a gun. I didn't either. Because we are sane level-headed adults. I explained to the little guys that she lives alone and doing that could be frightening. BTW - they had done it to me a few minutes earlier. So I explained that I had a reactive dog and it caused him to panic (we have a choo choo train doorbell).

One kid's parents knocked on our door after dinner, made him apologize again, and thanked me for intervening.

On the flip side - we've had threatening racist screeds dropped through our mail slot (front door) for severe years.

I get at least 40 of these in my Council email a month. Like - hang you and n-lover husband from the red maple. Nasty. Evil.

We have guns in our home. My husband is former Italian Special Forces (Tactical.sharp.shooter) and my dad was a Hunter/Green Beret/Survivalist. Killing and field dressing were survival basics - be it with a gun or a bow when i was growing up. My husband hunts wild boar in Calabria. I'm the President of a Black Woman's Gun and Survival Club.

If someone comes THROUGH our front door they are dead.

But a little kid kicking my door or ringing my door bell is not a reason to fire a gun. If you take the safety off a loaded gun your intent is to use it as intended: to kill.

This irrational fuck nut asshole ran after a little kid and shot him in the back.

I hope that man goes to jail for the rest of his life. He murdered that little kid.

Ding dong ditch is not a reason to kill someone.

Thank you for giving a gun owners perspective. There aren't a lot of us here.

To this day my revolver lays empty in a locked gun box in the master bedroom closet while the ammo is in a locked, metal box down in the basement .

It’s going to remain that way until I decide to resume training.

There are falsehoods being spread about this case, probably originating with people who don't want any controls on guns.

Let's not perpetuate the falsehoods here.

>> Let's not perpetuate the falsehoods here.
And let's not insinuate that I'm "perpetuating falsehoods", please and thank you.

I stated my opinion and asked that we on DU not perpetuate falsehoods.

The police report on this is clear. The children were ringing doorbells and running away. Not kicking the doors.

The man accused of murder allegedly hid in the dark outside the door, armed with one of his dozens of weapons, waiting for the children to return.

When they did he fired into the ground and when they ran away he shot the eleven year old in the back. This is what the police report says.

I'm sure his defense will raise all kinds of issues. Let's not help them.

And neither did I.

And still are.

You couldn't be more transparent.

The home owner knew it was just kids.
He waited outside with a gun for them to return and ring his bell and then chased them firing the gun into the ground first
He could have stopped at that and called the police but he didn't. He instead fired two more shots (that we know of) hitting the child in the back and killing him.
This was not fear but anger.

I'm sure he was angry... I would be angry too. Not angry enough to shoot a fleeing child.

I certainly hope that word of this tragedy spreads and parents start teaching their children better and watching where they go, when they go, and who they go with... as well as teaching them that sometimes there can be deadly consequences for their innocent pranks and tick-tock challenges. There's a lot of blame to go around for this tragic series of events.

The police and witnesses have given the facts and you are continue to insinuate that there is more to this and maybe the homeowner was in fear. He was not. He was angry and laid in wait with a gun for the kids to return. That's premeditated and fueled by anger not fear. He was the adult and if he was truly fearful hw would have called the police instead he fired a gun at a fleeing child.

There are many layers.

You are creating a sinerrio that has nothing to do with what happened in this particular case. There is video that shows the child ringing the bell, not kicking the door. There is a witness who stated the homeowner was waiting outside for the kids to return. The witnes stated he fired his first shot at the ground before he raised his gun and shot twice hitting the child in the back.
Those are facts. What you keep trying to insinuate, is that the homeowner might have been fearful and applying blame to everyone else but the angry guy with the gun
That's a blame the victim mentality. Unfortunately I know that when I see it because I have dealt with it too many times with my family.

I haven't insulted you, so it's unclear why anyone would think that it's okay to insult me or to characterize what they believe to be my "motivations" in such a negative way. I see no useful purpose in continuing this interaction, do you? --- Bye.

Have a nice day

Knocked on his door.

Putting up clips of teenagers kicking in doors in relation to this - doesn't make sense.

My husband lived in the Bronx for 8 years in the 70's. Ding dong ditch is nothing compared to the shenanigans he and his little grade school friends got into the night of the black out. They made it home alive but my father in law was there waiting.

He got his ass whooped. He said the candy and ice cream bars were worth it.

He also used to catch rides down to the docks on his roller skates on the back of cars and make a little money doing a little of this and a little of that. He was like - 10.

Life's a lot more pleasant that way.

In my own personal experience once the guns come out everything is FUBAR.

It doesn't really matter who is holding the guns.

I'm not worried about a few dumb ass kids doing dumb ass kid stuff.

I am worried about fully armed masked storm troopers beholding only to Mango Mussolini on the streets of our cities.

it's a seriously stupid thing to do with the number of gun humping cowards in EVERY neighborhood

Donkey kicking my door like you’re kicking it in will not be received well by anyone. Especially not in a high crime area of Houston.

The victim is an eleven year old child who repeatedly rang the doorbell. He didn't "donkey kick" anything. He definitely didn't bust in the door.

The man who shot this child waited in the dark next to his front door, and when the children returned, he shot this child in the back as he was running away.

I did similar dumb things as a child and I got sternly lectured by the adults I'd bothered. None of them shot me.

kicking doors. I would grab my gun and go to the door if someone was kicking my door like it was getting broken through like in the tik tok videos.

" The prank is part of a wider trend known as the “door-kicking challenge,” where teens kick on doors before fleeing and posting the footage online."

He knew it wasn't a home invasion.

The little boy kicked his door?

The first time I've heard or read this was in the OP. And that is not what triggered it.

They KNOCKED on his door.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2025/09/03/ding-dong-ditch-shooting-child-murder-investigation/85951930007/

Article that statea this 11 year old little boy was trying to kick in this asshole murderer's door.

He knocked.

The articles all say he knocked.

Then the murderer hid, shot into the ground, chased them and kept shooting. Dude is a wuss if he has to shoot a little kid in the back.

Can we agree on that? An entire grown ass man had his balls in his hand?

Almost every article is referencing the tik tok challenge. Which is banking with closed fists and donkey kicking the door. Even nbc says banging on the door. Chill. I’m sure details will come out at trial.

Knocking. Not banging.

Putting up snippets of teenagers kicking doors is falling for the media horse race where if the victim is a brown or black little boy they have the agency of 20 year old men.

That little guy looks like my nephew Alex - afro Latino.

He looks like one of mine. So I'm going to give a little kid the benefit of the doubt and not fall.for the media turning 11 year old little kids into super predators.

The murderer having Poor Home Training doesn't mean he gets a freebie from me.

So you should be able to provide links?

... to respond as he did. But I guess the truth will all come out as the details and investigation unfolds.

There is voluminous evidence from all over this country, year after year, that people shoot and kill others with less provocation than even the minimum version of what has been reported or talked about in this case.