General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSeptember 6, 2025
My last OP included my thoughts on the Epstein victim who voted for the convicted sex offender. Due to there being a single response, I thought I might follow up with something that potentially gets two comments. And I hope that this might serve as a model to illustrate what I learned about social-political activism decades ago.
Onondaga Chief Paul Waterman told me that it is best to be as flexible as water in order to build the strongest current. The flow of that water adjusts to circumstances in the stream of time. One must adopt to those currents, in order to reach the desired goals. This includes understanding that someone who opposed you in the past can never be on your side in the future, or that you friend on one issue will agree with you on every important thing in the future.
The first group to consider are the broken little people. A significant duty that Paul's seat on the Council of Chiefs was representing those marginalized in society. This was not limited to the Haudenosaunee people. It might help for me to give two examples that are both actual and symbolic. Paul often said that the song of the smallest bird was most pleasing to the Creator's ear. When Trout Unlimited asked Paul and I endorse one of their programs, Paul said yes if they agreed to list him and I as minnows unlimited.
Paul told me that in order to help society reach higher ground, we needed to start at the bottom. The marginalized, the poor, the hungry, the homeless, the addicts, the victims, the wounded warriors. For no society gains in goodness if it sacrifices a portion of its population. Indeed, those wounded by trauma and/or addiction may become the strongest of wounded warriors. So do not be so rigid in judging others by their past that you can't see who they are today, or who they may become tomorrow.
At the same time, do not project your hopes in a way that will result in being vulnerable to your true opposition. Do not be that boy that carries the cold rattlesnake down the mountain, no matter what it says. And there are numerous rattlesnakes among the nests of maga. Let's consider two examples, shall we?
We might start with Elise Marie Stefanik, She was elected to the House as a moderate republican, before that species became extinct. Though she had begun by voting against the felon in his first term, she is ambitious in the worst sense of the term. It soon appeared she favored the brown lipstick that resulted from having her lips sealed to the felon's anal pore. Those behind the felon found her a more attractive supporter than, say, Marjorie Taylor Greene or Lauren Boebert.
The felon had nominated Elise to serve as U.N. Ambassador in January of this year. Two months later, the nomination was withdrawn, with the official excuse being that she was needed to secure her seat in the overwhelmingly republican 21st NYS congressional district. The actual cause of the withdrawal was rooted in her last meeting with the felon. After she left the meeting, the felon turned to Stephen Miller, and said, What happened to her? She's gained fifty pounds! I don't want another Sara Hippobee!
This became an administration giggle that got back to Elise. Because of her ambition, it might be said she has moved her lips from pore to cheek, but she still knows she cannot express her sense of victimhood and betrayal orally. Instead, she has decided to run for governor in 2026. Because I have associates in her district, I can say this move is that of a opportunist without conscience: she wants to be at least the VP candidate in 2028, and if not, the republican presidential candidate in 2032.
Elise is a prime example of a maga rattlesnake we must never trust. To quote Phil Collins: Well if you told me you were drowning, I would not lend a hand. . Well, I was there and I saw what you did. I saw it with my own two eyes. Stephanik is solid septic waste the cult has dumped into the stream that causes serious disease. We need to get her ilk out of our political system.
Now let's consider MTG. She is a horrible human being, and has been most accurately described by Rep. Jasmine Crockett. I will admit that I had hoped she would get into a physical fight with Boebert when they were snarling at each other. There is nothing nice to say about this white christian nationalist who served as the felon's choir while chanting q-anon, antisemitic, white genocide conspiracy theories.
First elected to the House in 2020, she was fooled into believing she would be the felon's VP pick after he announced in 2022 he was running again. She was, in her walnut-sized brain, the perfect anti-Pence, who attracted a wider range of support than had Sarah Palin. Yet we know there was zero chance that the felon would pick anyone who could challenge his being the champion of splattering lies and delusions to his base.
Her sense of betrayal has thus merged with her ambition. She knows that while her seat is safe in 2026's mid-terms, that the felon will be reduced to a rabid lame duck. She is convinced that even now, his health is on the decline. She is aware that some around him, seeing that decline gaining momentum, are quietly positioning themselves to be the next leader. Even Steve Bannon has told associates that he should be the next president, a thought as repulsively hideous as Steve himself.
MTG has attempted to inject herself into the movement supporting the victims of Epstein and Maxwell. That does not mean that Democrats should trust her any more than a chilly rattlesnake. We lift up victims who hope to heal, not rattlesnakes seeking to bite. But we recognize that while we never unite with her, there is potential gain for Democrats so long as she openly opposes the felon on this. So we leave no opening for her hijack any leadership position of consequence, we do want her to divide the cult. The opportunity is there, and she may be a useful opportunist.
My next OP will feature a document that my associate, code name Sinn Fein, got from maga representative Gus Bilirakis regarding the Epstein Maxwell scandal. It is important for Democrats to get maga republicans on record on this as we approach the mid-terms. Although he and his father combine to represent their district since 1983, we will coordinate with the 2026 campaign to replace him with a Democrat. It's high time we make this toad face a real challenge.

Easterncedar
(4,937 posts)H2O Man
(77,957 posts)We need to keep our eyes on the prize. That includes keeping the felon on the defense as much as possible, and at this time, the Epstein - Maxwell scandal is where he is most vulnerable. We must stir the pot, confident that this is the one issue where we can divide his cult. In order to increase Democratic Party success in 2026, it actually is not a large percentage of maga-minded republicans we need to split away. It's unlikely that any will vote for our candidates. But we can increase the numbers of those supporting a third party, or just not voting. This involves focus upon specific states.
Easterncedar
(4,937 posts)Fracture the base at this weak point
I will add that fracturing the base at its weakest point requires understanding how the felon and top supporters will attempt to block such efforts. A good example came when they attempted to float the rumor that the felon informed the FBI on Epstein's activities. The responses on the internet -- including on this forum -- suggests that too many Democrats are uninformed or misinformed.
As I have been saying since the larger issue gained attention in July, the felon and Epstein broke up their 15 year bromance after the felon bought a Florida mansion that he knew Epstein had bid on, for Epstein had showed it to him and told him how much he had bid. Epstein knew the felon did not have the needed resources. When the felon would soon sell the mansion to a wealthy Russian, Epstein recognized this as laundering Russian mob money.
Both the felon and Epstein claim that they were the one who initiated their "divorce." Since both are the definition of "pathological liars," no one can say with certainty. But what can be said is that wealthy Russian told the felon that Epstein was an asset for international intelligence. Epstein himself would come to benefit financially using Russian-friendly banks -- including one the felon used. The felon had been bragging about out-smarting Epsein on a real estate deal; the Russian was giving him a gentle warning.
Being paranoid, the felon wanted to strike Epstein before Epstein struck him. This is a feature common among sociopaths at all economic levels and/or social status. At that time, the felon was only aware of one US intelligence agency that surfs the international, the CIA. But he remembered a friendly FBI agent warning him about mob influence in properties such as gambling casinoes in Atlantic City. Thus, there has long been an unconfirmed rumor that the felon dropped dime on Epstein for tax evasion.
Now, even if that is only a rumor -- or perhaps a lie the felon once told -- there is an Epstein file that notes the rumor. That is "raw intelligence," not unlike the file that Jeb Bush's campaign started, then handed over to the Democrats after his campaign died a lonely death. For rumors are frequently documented as raw intelligence.
No matter if it was merely a rumor, most likely started by the felon's lie, it will be somewhere in the files. The opposition in Congress is trying to make it sound like there are "top secret" files where the felon served as the American James Bond. Way, wat too top secret/national security to be released to the public.
Our job is to be able to respond correctly as this unfolds. That is not a difficult task, so long as one is familiar with the actual relationship between Epstein, Maxwell, and the felon.
dweller
(27,153 posts) in order to help society reach higher ground, we needed to start at the bottom. The marginalized, the poor, the hungry, the homeless, the addicts, the victims, the wounded warriors. For no society gains in goodness if it sacrifices a portion of its population. Indeed, those wounded by trauma and/or addiction may become the strongest of wounded warriors. So do not be so rigid in judging others by their past that you can't see who they are today, or who they may become tomorrow
✌🏻
It seems that is a common message from my mentors, Paul Waterman and Rubin Carter. It was what Malcolm X and Gandhi taught.
calimary
(87,890 posts)I may have to use it for the next CTA.
Much appreciated.
niyad
(127,417 posts)I like that these victims of Epstein and Maxwell are demonstrating what reminds me of another of Chief Waterman's teachings. The essence of the Haudenosaunee -- or Six Nations Iroquois Confederacy -- is based upon the message of their third prophet, Hianawetha. He was a reformation prophet, updating the earlier second reformation prophet, the Peace Maker, who updated the message of Willow from 4,000+ years ago.
Alone, we are like a finger that our enemy can easily break; together, we become a powerful fist that protects us all.
There is a sad history associated with the victims of Epstein and Maxwell. A number of victims have been reported to take their own lives. And it is possible that they did. Perhaps due to the death of Epstein, and questions it raises, I know that some of those supporting these ladies are concerned for their safety at this time. That isn't limited to "the mob," for the felon has given license to his cult to use violence to advance his positions.
It is important that the grass roots support them, and every sincere effort to open the files. We need good people to participate in creating a power fist.
yonder
(10,142 posts)I try to take the dog out to the pond with me daily, when I am feeding the birds and fish. When everyone is fed, and she is tracking a hundred scents with an intense focus that leads her in circles, I try to think. Sometimes, in my mind, I say, "Okay, Paul and Rubin! Don't leave me now! For what am I to do?" Then I hear them say, "We've already taught you. Now get to work."
It is at these times I am able to recall what I need to communicate to others, in hopes that no one mistakenly thinks I am the source. The wisdom of humanity is available to us now, so long as we can "turn off our minds, relax and float downstream," as John sang.
hay rick
(9,062 posts)I posted this graphic during Trump's May, 2024 felony trial. The courtroom was graced by a succession of lowlifes seeking to become his running mate.
H2O Man
(77,957 posts)and the dog rang for cover when I burst out laughing when I saw this! It is a fantastic example of the power of humor that speaks the truth!
Thank you so much.