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mahatmakanejeeves

(66,755 posts)
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 06:05 PM Sep 10

"The death of human empathy is one of the earliest and most telling signs of a culture about to fall into barbarism."

Reposted by Mike Masnick
https://bsky.app/profile/mmasnick.bsky.social

Qasim Rashid, Esq.
‪@qasimrashid.com‬

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Hannah Arendt said 'The death of human empathy is one of the earliest & most telling signs of a culture about to fall into barbarism'

We saw the recent cruelty of MAGA denying empathy to Melissa Hortman

Empathy for Kirk—not because he ever acted like a decent human—but because we are decent humans
September 10, 2025 at 4:37 PM

Hannah Arendt said 'The death of human empathy is one of the earliest & most telling signs of a culture about to fall into barbarism'

We saw the recent cruelty of MAGA denying empathy to Melissa Hortman

Empathy for Kirk—not because he ever acted like a decent human—but because we are decent humans

Qasim Rashid, Esq. (@qasimrashid.com) 2025-09-10T20:37:17.916Z
39 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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"The death of human empathy is one of the earliest and most telling signs of a culture about to fall into barbarism." (Original Post) mahatmakanejeeves Sep 10 OP
Nope, can't do it. FirstLight Sep 10 #1
Arendt is right. You're right. Decent human beings feel empathy for others, no matter who they are. sop Sep 10 #2
..live by hatred, die by hatred.. thomski64 Sep 10 #6
Nothing until we know more. marble falls Sep 10 #3
Nope. I have no empathy for hate mongers and people who celebrate gun deaths Autumn Sep 10 #4
Sorry, but Kirk was anti-empathy, so, I'm honoring his wishes in that regard. Coventina Sep 10 #5
It is very empathetic of you to reflect his values back at him. RockRaven Sep 10 #11
Hannah Arendt had a romance with a literal Nazi SamuelTheThird Sep 10 #7
Yikes didn't realize that fujiyamasan Sep 11 #24
I'd dispute that she 'enabled' him muriel_volestrangler Sep 11 #30
Agreed Prairie Gates Sep 11 #33
Arendt DEFENDED Heidegger post-war SamuelTheThird Sep 11 #37
I wasn't calling her an enabler, but Kirk SamuelTheThird Sep 11 #36
"I can't stand the word empathy. Actually I think empathy is a made up New Age term that does a lot of damage." muriel_volestrangler Sep 10 #8
Yeah, well, Americans are not decent human beings. At least not a majority. RockRaven Sep 10 #9
Disagree. I think there Still more Empathetic Americans than not... electric_blue68 Sep 10 #13
Interesting that Mike Lee of Utah was the biggest asshole commenting on Hortman's killing Ponietz Sep 10 #10
Hannah would hate Mark Twain Torchlight Sep 10 #12
I have empathy for his family and the students mcar Sep 10 #14
This message was self-deleted by its author WarGamer Sep 10 #15
Did you weep for Pol Pot? dpibel Sep 10 #16
+1 BannonsLiver Sep 10 #21
Maybe conditional empathy ain't so bad, after all dpibel Sep 11 #23
Been a tough day for you? W_HAMILTON Sep 10 #20
Are we going to have this same discussion when Putin dies? Cuthbert Allgood Sep 10 #17
I don't have moral relativism about evil JCMach1 Sep 10 #18
This message was self-deleted by its author Random Person Sep 10 #19
Judging by the comments I have seen today, it seems to be dying on DU. milestogo Sep 10 #22
Sorry I'll sit this one out fujiyamasan Sep 11 #25
That might be true but how did we get here? ecstatic Sep 11 #26
Perhaps I'm missing something Keepthesoulalive Sep 11 #27
that train has already left the station. nt ImNotGod Sep 11 #28
Well said ihavenoidea Sep 11 #29
With all due respect to Hannah Arendt (and my respect for her is substantial) . . . . hatrack Sep 11 #31
I don't think Arendt had any illusions about that Prairie Gates Sep 11 #34
I wouldn't put it in hens' teeth territory, but judging by the last 20 years, it seems to be lacking in Americans . . . hatrack Sep 11 #39
Hate speech deserves no empathy. Emile Sep 11 #32
To me this is just the natural result of GREED and a few evil apples at the top doing ANYTHING/EVERYTHING to not SHARE? Brainfodder Sep 11 #35
No empathy here. fshrink Sep 11 #38

FirstLight

(15,747 posts)
1. Nope, can't do it.
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 06:07 PM
Sep 10

I may not be dancing, but I certainly have more bitterness than empathy for him and all of them. I guess we are devolved into barbarians, but what did you expect? I'm not going to take the high road on any of this

sop

(16,089 posts)
2. Arendt is right. You're right. Decent human beings feel empathy for others, no matter who they are.
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 06:13 PM
Sep 10

Our culture fell into barbarism a long time ago, Kirk's death is just one more example.

thomski64

(728 posts)
6. ..live by hatred, die by hatred..
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 06:17 PM
Sep 10

There's one common thread in all
these shootings...







.....guns...

Autumn

(48,369 posts)
4. Nope. I have no empathy for hate mongers and people who celebrate gun deaths
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 06:15 PM
Sep 10

to preserve their fucking gun rights.

"I think it's worth to have a cost of, unfortunately, some gun deaths every single year so that we can have the Second Amendment to protect our other God-given rights".


"Do you know how many transgender Americans have been mass shooters over the last 10 years?” an audience members asked. Kirk responded: “Too many.”

The questioner followed up: “Do you know how many mass shooters there have been in America over the last 10 years?”

“Counting or not counting gang violence?” Kirk asked.

Then he was shot.


Fuck him. Decent people owe him no emapthy. The universe got it right.

Coventina

(28,718 posts)
5. Sorry, but Kirk was anti-empathy, so, I'm honoring his wishes in that regard.
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 06:16 PM
Sep 10

*Coventina resumes grave-dancing*

fujiyamasan

(708 posts)
24. Yikes didn't realize that
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 01:32 AM
Sep 11

And had to look it up. I’ll have to find more about it. I knew there was some controversy about her, but never knew about the affair.

How banal.

muriel_volestrangler

(104,758 posts)
30. I'd dispute that she 'enabled' him
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 06:13 AM
Sep 11

I presume this is Heidegger. She had an affair with him in the mid 20s, before he showed any Nazi signs. In the 30s, he joined the party; not in charge of any crimes, but doing nothing to denounce or prevent them either - what his feelings about Jews really were, who knows, but she was Jewish herself, of course.

After the war, they reconnected (resumed a physical relationship? I don't know), and she defended him. But I don't think that's "enabling" him - because he didn't do Nazi things after that.

Given her work helping Jews to emigrate to Palestine, and her arrest by the Gestapo, I don't think it's fair to dismiss her as a "fascist enabler", or to implicitly dismiss her ideas.

Prairie Gates

(6,292 posts)
33. Agreed
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 07:23 AM
Sep 11

Bashing Arendt for her affair with Heidegger is very silly business.

That said, I wouldn't exactly say that he showed no Nazi signs in the 1920s. There's a good case to be made that much of his philosophy was proto-Nazi and certainly right wing all throughout that period.

Heidegger's writings on Jews are much better understood after the release of the so-called black notebooks. They are pretty bad. The major rub for Heidegger scholars is that he absolutely refused to apologize for any of it, even when begged to do so (by Arendt, among others!). Of course, he was barred from teaching after the war as part of the de-Nazification programs. One Heidegger scholar, on writing about the postwar period and the black notebooks, concludes simply that Heidegger was prideful and had a "hard heart" (see Krell, Ecstasy, Catastrophe: From Being and Time to the Black Notebooks). It seems an insufficient judgment.

In any case, I agree with the gist of what you're saying here, and the attempt to discredit Arendt's point on empathy by pointing to her relationship with Heidegger is...not great.

SamuelTheThird

(277 posts)
37. Arendt DEFENDED Heidegger post-war
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 11:48 AM
Sep 11

We didn't even need his journals to see his Nazi support.

She had empathy (and love) for Heidegger, and that made her do the disgusting thing she did

SamuelTheThird

(277 posts)
36. I wasn't calling her an enabler, but Kirk
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 11:46 AM
Sep 11

I'm not sure what Id call her, but her gross defense of Heidegger post-war was a kind of enabling though.

RockRaven

(18,022 posts)
9. Yeah, well, Americans are not decent human beings. At least not a majority.
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 06:21 PM
Sep 10

Empathy is dead in the US. It's primary executioners were Reagan, Gingrich, and Murdoch, and its date of death was a few seconds after we elected a black guy POTUS.

electric_blue68

(23,902 posts)
13. Disagree. I think there Still more Empathetic Americans than not...
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 07:06 PM
Sep 10

It's that the less so, or totally unempathetic people are louder esp since drumphf was first elected.
He gave them "permission" to be out, and about.
Imho.

Ponietz

(4,035 posts)
10. Interesting that Mike Lee of Utah was the biggest asshole commenting on Hortman's killing
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 06:22 PM
Sep 10
Rather than offering condolences or condemning the violence, Lee posted a photo of the alleged gunman, Vance Boelter, wearing a latex face mask. He captioned it, “This is what happens… When Marxists don’t get their way.” Lee also shared another post with the caption, “Nightmare on Waltz Street,” referencing Minnesota Governor Tim Walz.


https://apnews.com/article/mike-lee-posts-senate-minnesota-lawmakers-shot-eb58f097a2e627b9441f64ac6f7bbaa8

Torchlight

(5,696 posts)
12. Hannah would hate Mark Twain
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 06:28 PM
Sep 10
I have been reading the morning paper. I do it every morning—knowing well that I shall find in it the usual depravities and basenesses and hypocrisies and cruelties that make up civilization, and cause me to put in the rest of the day pleading for the damnation of the human race. I cannot seem to get my prayers answered, yet I do not despair

mcar

(45,344 posts)
14. I have empathy for his family and the students
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 07:07 PM
Sep 10

None for him. He cared more about guns than human lives.

Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

dpibel

(3,666 posts)
16. Did you weep for Pol Pot?
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 08:38 PM
Sep 10

Will you be sad when Putin dies?

How about Muammar Gaddafi? His death was particularly brutal and grotesque.

BannonsLiver

(19,630 posts)
21. +1
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 08:51 PM
Sep 10

Pretty sure I know the answer to the Putin question. It’s not exactly a mystery at this point.

dpibel

(3,666 posts)
23. Maybe conditional empathy ain't so bad, after all
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 12:45 AM
Sep 11

Who knew?

It was worse than the death of empathy. And now it's just a blank space.

Cuthbert Allgood

(5,328 posts)
17. Are we going to have this same discussion when Putin dies?
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 08:39 PM
Sep 10

No. We aren't. Kirk was a horrible human being. I don't need to have empathy for him. I'm sorry for his children that they lost their dad. How's that?

JCMach1

(28,987 posts)
18. I don't have moral relativism about evil
Wed Sep 10, 2025, 08:42 PM
Sep 10

I call it out when I see it and Kirk exemplified a modern American brand of evil.

Response to mahatmakanejeeves (Original post)

fujiyamasan

(708 posts)
25. Sorry I'll sit this one out
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 01:39 AM
Sep 11

I have only so many fucks to give about the state of the world. Most of my fucks are given about my family. The rest are sparingly given (the state of democracy is one, and I actually have empathy for dead kids at school and their families).

Kirk, in life or death really doesn’t get any and he wouldn’t have given any either.


ecstatic

(34,934 posts)
26. That might be true but how did we get here?
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 01:48 AM
Sep 11

Kirk and others like him helped to get us to this place.

I don't condone what happened to CK, if for no other reason than I do not ever want to see that happen to someone on our side.

I feel empathy for his family, especially his kids who may end up seeing the horrific video online at some point. But we're talking about a guy who viciously attacked various groups, several of which I am a part of. If David Duke gets shot do I have to feel empathy for him too? WTF?

Keepthesoulalive

(1,828 posts)
27. Perhaps I'm missing something
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 01:49 AM
Sep 11

Japanese internment camps, Native American genocide, slavery, which group to hate this week and the most recent was putting children in cages without proper identification treating them worse than a dog in a boarding facility. This is America without the false halo, let’s be honest and see her without her makeup.

hatrack

(63,577 posts)
31. With all due respect to Hannah Arendt (and my respect for her is substantial) . . . .
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 06:25 AM
Sep 11

I have doubts that empathy is a very common human attribute.

hatrack

(63,577 posts)
39. I wouldn't put it in hens' teeth territory, but judging by the last 20 years, it seems to be lacking in Americans . . .
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 05:47 PM
Sep 11

It doesn't awaken as easily in me as it once did, I know that . . .

Brainfodder

(7,781 posts)
35. To me this is just the natural result of GREED and a few evil apples at the top doing ANYTHING/EVERYTHING to not SHARE?
Thu Sep 11, 2025, 07:30 AM
Sep 11

The barriers, the lawyering, the absurdly expensive shit just for them.

Root of all evil....

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