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Tumbulu

(6,605 posts)
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 11:34 AM Friday

Can someone explain to me why the airlines or the cities cannot pay or lend money to

the air traffic controllers? And for that matter, since the federal government has not been able to adequately fund the training of these controllers, why have the states or cities not stepped up? These shutdowns have become a regular feature of this regime. Why the heck hasn’t there been a Gavin Newsom style solution to this?

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LetMyPeopleVote

(172,486 posts)
2. Denver airport seeks permission to pay air traffic controllers, sets up food and essentials pantry for federal workers
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 11:39 AM
Friday

Denver International Airport has asked the FAA whether airport revenue could be used to pay air traffic controllers during the shutdown.



https://www.9news.com/article/news/local/denver-international-airport-pay-air-traffic-controllers-food-pantry/73-5a85ffae-fcbb-4a99-800c-549f97b8f944

DENVER — Denver International Airport is working to help federal employees who are working without pay during the government shutdown.

DIA said in a release on Wednesday that it has submitted a request to the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) asking whether airport revenue could be used to pay air traffic controllers. The airport said it has requested a waiver on any prohibition on utilizing its own revenue to support air traffic controllers and other federal employees as they conduct essential airport operations.

DIA said it will also request reimbursement from the federal government once the shutdown is over.

“This is a critical time for travel both here at DEN and around the country. Staffing issues are already being identified at a number of airports, impacting travel. As the shutdown drags on, air traffic controllers, in particular, are being stressed unnecessarily,” said Phil Washington, airport CEO. “As part of our airport family, it’s our hope that we can reduce the hardship on them by covering their wages during the shutdown, with reimbursement by the FAA later. We would love to be able to do more and provide wage support for all the federal workers at DEN, as they are all critical to our operation, but given the number of federal employees, we are only able to support controllers at this time.”




Ocelot II

(128,249 posts)
3. Almost all states are prohibited from carrying a deficit like the federal government.
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 11:42 AM
Friday

Most are probably too strapped already to do such things, and they aren't allowed to borrow to cover a shortfall. Airports have their own budgets, and in this case they still have to get federal permission to make the payments.

Tumbulu

(6,605 posts)
6. Well, they need to figure out a way to deal with this,
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 12:03 PM
Friday

as this has become a feature of this admin.

Either someone lends the controllers their salaries, or start paying them in addition to what the federal government pays them, so that people start wanting to take those jobs.

The long time problem is that pay is not high enough for the stress and responsibility. Ever since Reagan screwed them all.

So, come up with a solution, it has only been brewing for 45 years now.

I am so sick of people passing the problems along. This is not that much money- how many controllers work at each airport? How about putting tip jars at the gates - let passengers pay them tips. I bet that would generate some funds.

The reason the dems keep losing is that they keep playing by the rules, when the rules are all tossed out by these ruthless bastards and we take them to court. And they ignore the orders.

And then the Supreme Court says it is ok for the R’s to break all the rules, just not anyone with a D in front of them.

So just do things for the moment- pay them all for goodness sake, out of any fund available, and then work it out later.

Thanks for responding to my post Ocellot II, I am just venting my frustration.

Ocelot II

(128,249 posts)
8. The point I was making is that there *are* no funds available at the state or local level,
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 12:26 PM
Friday

and tip jars at airports isn't going to do it. Air traffic controllers are actually paid very well, and it isn't a job anyone would take if they didn't really like it and take it very seriously (I've known several ATC and they love their work). But the only way the air traffic control system can work is by keeping it federally-regulated and managed so it's consistent throughout the country. There are private air traffic control services at some smaller airports, and in those cases a private company employs the controllers under a contract with the FAA, which pays them through the private company, while the airport authority pays for the tower and associated equipment. The controllers are trained and regulated by the same FAA rules as FAA controllers. It applies only to towers (local control) and not to TRACON or en-route facilities. https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/ato/service_units/mission_support/faa_contract_tower_program

Tumbulu

(6,605 posts)
9. The point that I am trying to make is that this system is failing us
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 01:53 PM
Friday

And it is time to come up with better ways to deal with shutdowns, since they are perennial now. And or come up with a system that allows for multiple payment streams. Licensing can still be a federal system, but payment of the personnel could become more flexible. And certainly it needs to be higher, or they would not have such a shortage of staff. And a shortage of people to train.



Ocelot II

(128,249 posts)
10. ATC has a union, NATCA, formed after Reagan fired the controllers in the '80s
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 01:56 PM
Friday

and gutted PATCO, the previous union. Any changes in the way ATC are paid and hired would have to be approved and managed by NATCA before anything else is done.

bucolic_frolic

(53,228 posts)
5. It's a federal system with federal responsibility
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 11:47 AM
Friday

Terrible precedent for airports, airlines to pay, even temporarily.

If you're going to go down that route, why should people who don't fly subsidize the ATC system with their tax dollars? Why not revert to a Reagan-era idea - user fees - to pay their salaries? I'm sure passengers won't mind coughing up another $20 a flight, amiright?

Tumbulu

(6,605 posts)
7. My route is pragmatism, and maybe the costs get born by those who fly
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 12:06 PM
Friday

No problem with me, just fix it so that the whole nation is not held hostage by these crazed R’s.

How about tip jars at the gates, and tip jars for the TSA agents, see how that works out.

Srkdqltr

(9,096 posts)
11. Why aren't they paid by the airport? With money from the airlines who get their revenue from the flights
Fri Nov 7, 2025, 02:03 PM
Friday

which can't move without the controllers?
Seems stupid and counterproductive to be paid by the government.

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