That won't work this time.

This is a disaster for the Democratic party any way you look at it. I'm sick of coming onto DU and every freaking bad behavior being explained away. Oh, it's strategy, etc., etc. Yada. Yada. Yada.

It's just caving in YET AGAIN to the bully Republicans and makes Democrats look weak. Voters will see the weakness and Americans (as a whole) like strong leaders.

Every poster on here "explaining it all away" needs to take a look at what Newsom is saying. Are these posters really smarter and/or better informed than he is? I don't think so.

He and Pritzker are the ONLY ones who seem to truly understand what it is that we are fighting against. The typical norms certainly do not work any more. Democrats should never have started this if they weren't going to finish it.

I don't think it will work this time.

So, what's next on the agenda for these Nazi fucks?
The elimination of Medicare?
The elimination of SNAP?
The elimination of Social Security?
Give these Nazis an inch, they'll take a mile.

By the end of the week.

It's there anyone that has the guts to lead the minority?

I would like to see AOC take the reins of the Democratic Party and start taking it to these criminal fucks.

and his vote wouldn't matter.
This was about, IMHO, preserving Chuckies, spot.

Was that reported? Or is that just what you think?

Why else would he screw Dems?

1. Chuck Schumer risked a lot by keeping the government closed for the longest time ever. It was always a chance that the majority of Americans would be upset by this and it would backfire on our party.
Then your view,
2. Chuck Schumer caved for no reason at all even though he still voted to keep it closed. This with public opinion on our side to keep it closed and the Democratic party just won historic elections.
That makes sense to you?

but the bottom line is the Sen. Schumer, IMHO, already knew who was going to vote for the CR and knew his voting no would be meaningless, he did what most pols do, he voted to enhance his creds.

when the rubber hit the road, IMHO, he came up short.
That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it, you may have another opinion, and I respect that while disagreeing with it.

How is that better?

We had too many dilemmas, let them hurt health care, let them hurt hungry people, let them eff up flying, there were just too many harms going on and they (reps) didn't give a shit. I Thought we should hold but unfortunately 8 dems did not.

How in the hell does giving into a bully not make the bully believe that he can just ask for more concessions the next time?

Because of THIS, people are going to be a whole lot MORE hurt, MORE sick and there will be MORE issues flying. Not to mention everything else that the Republicans will think they can get away with now.

There is no excuse for Democrats giving in. They should not have started this if they weren't going to finish it.

I wanted to keep it closed but I am also proud of what the other dems did.

That just shows that we don't have a unified party. Go, figure.

That is why they all needed to stand together. Kicking the can down the road will only lead to more suffering.

It happens all of the time.

A leader knows how many votes are needed and which Senators can afford politically to vote with the Republicans, and which ones need to appear to be opposed to the Republicans. That happens all of the time. If, on the other hand, a leader does not know that, then they should not be in leadership.

Do you people not realize what's at stake here?!

It's actual people's lives. Literally, people, lots of us, are going to die.

I cannot not believe the level of I've got mine, or we can't bear the inconvenience any longer, I'm reading here.

In no way am I saying that the 8 democratic senators vote was right, I am against it 100%. I'm saying that the other Democratic Senators put up a phenomenal fight!

This isn't a dilemma, it's literally a death sentence. I can see how calling such merely a "dilemma" makes it feel less horrifying but it in no way reduces the sentence inflicted on those sentenced to die.

It's not just the 8 who voted for this, it's the lack of leadership which made them feel safe doing so. The Republicans hold their line and the Democrats are too weak to stand up as a force against this atrocious gutting of the ACA. This is our legacy.

This is a bridge too far for this loyal, lifetime politically active Democrat.

A dilemma is
a situation that requires a choice between two or more options that are equally undesirable or problematic.

We keep the government closed and people go hungry, dont get paid, essential services are not done.
We relent and tons of people lose health care and it goes up for most.
There was no good option there for the Democratic party. That is why it was not a problem. A problem can be solved, with a dilemma no matter what you do the outcomes are bad.
You say the Democrats are weak yet we held the longest shutdown ever, longer than any party.
I would say if the bridge is too far you didnt understand that we had always lost the bridge. What was important was to fight as long as we could. And we did. Historically long.
I'm sorry if you thought we were going to win this.
The only thing that would have made the republicans cave in was public pressure.
And they just dont give a fuck. President and all.
We fought for a historically long time. Some of us caved eventually.
They caved to a dilemma.
There werent any good solutions there.
But I will support those who didnt cave, cause they fought hard.
And those that didnt,
Well,,

Lots of people like myself will die.

How did that get lost in your diatribe? It's not a difficult statement yet it's being treated like kryptonite.

People aren't getting paychecks! Important!!

People are having their SNAP withheld! Important!!

Healthcare is being held hostage for tens of millions of Americans. Oh, sorry, you gotta die because this is too hard for the Democratic Party to manage. People are suffering, don't ya, know?

Do none of you hear what's being said here?

It kept her alive for 5 more years. No way she could have afforded that in any way.
That didn't get lost in my diatribe at all.
I understand on a very personal level.
Whats more important, health care or food?
I cant answer that question.
Cause its a dilemma.
If a kid is starving are you going to offer it health care or food?
If a mom is dying of cancer are you going to offer her food or health care?

No one can give me healthcare. Let's not be fools and pretend otherwise. It costs hundreds of thousands a year to keep a cancer patient alive per year due to our fucked up healthcare.

I emptied my pantry and donated enough food for dozens of people for weeks.

How does that compare?

That the aca kept her alive for 5 years and you gave food away?
Sorry I'm pretty sure you did not make yourself clear. If you are out because of that then fine.
Be out.

Death is death and in my case I'll live longer without food than my meds. But that never should be a choice! We should never be that shallow as humans.

What the hell is wrong with you?! This isn't even a philosophical question. All people matter, or at least they should.

Jesus, if you looked at my facebook page I'm raging about it all the time. I think the ACA is one of the best things we have and that we should have kept the expanded subsidies. You keep thinking that I am saying that is alright because I am proud of the work our Democratic reps have done. They fought a fight that they couldnt win and they did it for longer than anyone else has with the shutdown.
The ones that caved, whatever.
The ones that fought a historic fight for this? I got their back.

I plan to burn them to the ground with my death.

The first part of course.

I reached out to ProPublica and the NYT. I'm hoping someone bites.

Why hold out all this time to accomplish nothing?

They showed Trump that they will bend to his will. That’s what you call the right thing.

8 dems! It sucks but the rest of the Dems did a historical fight!! They fought hard and we should be proud of that.

Those lives are not safe in the hands of the Republicans. Compromising with the Republicans puts those lives into their hands.

And in the end it was for no purpose.

Hard to argue against that, we got nothing in return for all the hardships the country endured.

What are you celebrating?

Thanks for affirming that.

the history is there for all too see.

Obamacare was supposed to be a democratic legacy. They’re throwing it away. A lot of people will be hurt, but maybe they deserve to at this point. I don’t really care anymore.

Negotiate better, maybe voters will respect you. I know now why democratic office holders hold no loyalty. They don’t really care about their constituents. It’s all a game and a joke.

all for nothing. I know your going to say it was only 8 senators that caved but there is a fundamental problem now with the Democratic party which is that it's clear they are owned by corporate donors. There is always a spoiler within the Democratic party that sabotages them whether it's Mancin, Sinema, or somebody else. There is no doubt in my mind if those 8 senators didn't sell out then donors would have found some other 8 who were willing to sell out at the right price.

Oh, and WTI - I don't need any more of your "thoughts" going forward.

and you are?,,,,,,,,,,

That is some grade A cope.

"Shows" is the operative word, as in performative.

I am certain that every Democrat in the Senate knew how this was going to go. The only question was which Senators could most afford to cave without too much political consequence.

The Repubs get the talking point that Dems shutdown the Govt in 25 for no reason.

This was a complete, thorough and epic Fuck Up!