If we didn't have ourselves to fight, what would we do with our time?

(Kind of? But kind of not?)

Biden is still alive and well. If Shapiro has a problem with Biden running for the presidency in 2024, then Shapiro should have talked to him about it.

I'm not sure that was any kind of alternative for KH.

But it could be one for JD Vance if any grassroots republicans would get after him to do it!

Amendment articulates how a VP and principal officers of the executive departments declare a POTUS unable to discharge Presidential duties. It does not, however, require them to do so. I'll post the verbatim text and note that the amendment applies to ability, not fitness.

"Whenever the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President shall immediately assume the powers and duties of the office as Acting President."

Gov Shapiro could have been referring to an obligation, if subpoenaed, to testify before House and Senate Judiciary and/or Oversight Committees. I really don't believe he was going that far.

“I can tell you that I wasn’t in the room, but when I was confronted with engaging with the former president, in looking at it simply from the perspective of, how is he doing in Pennsylvania? Could he win Pennsylvania? Because, I think, Stephen, you understand, if you can’t win Pennsylvania, it’s pretty darn hard to win the national election,” Shapiro continued. “And I was very vocal with him, privately, and extremely vocal with his staff about my concerns about his fitness to be able to run for another term. I was direct with them. I told them my concerns.”

like it. That’s past, what are you going to do for us now and in the future is what I want to know.

Start you motors! It's never too early to take a swing at a potential rival.

Joe Biden was a great president who exceeded my expectations with regard to his progressive policies and accomplishments. That said, he should have never sought a second term.

Soon after Biden won in 2020 he said that he views himself as a "transition president", leading many to believe that he only intended to serve one term. Anyone who continues to believe that he would have beaten Trump had he stayed in the race is not facing the fact that internal polling showed that Biden would have lost to Trump in a landslide.

How could anyone who watched that disastrous debate continue to believe that Joe Biden was up to the job for a second term? And let me be clear, that's not knocking Joe Biden, that is simply recognizing the reality of Joe Biden's cognitive decline.

Take your post for instance. I have no interest in hearing anymore about this from someone who can’t separate a wild game show that has nothing to do with his job, from his job. Good day!

He governed responsibly. What is the issue here.

Shapiro is nuts. He's trying to wreck a person he feels likely to run against him.

I would give anything to have Biden back right now.

He sounds like the bad guy but who really is a good guy. It sounds like he did vocalize his position. What more could he do against a freight train coming. I liked Biden and still do but I do feel like it was a Ruth Ginsburg situation. I feel democrats need to make strong level headed decisions. We do not have a royal family in this country but it sure feels like it sometimes. May the person with the best vision and strongest record and qualifications move forward. And the voters can decide if that person is healthy enough in the primaries. We need a strong new wave to carry us forward.

She doesn't have to do anything.

He's wrong.

I'm old enough to remember Ronald Reagan's second term in office when his alzheimer's diagnosis was shielded from the public,,,he wasn't making decisions..his staff was...

At that time I don't recall any republicans rushing to throw each under the bus for what actually amounted to a coverup of a president who actually had Alzheimers and wasn't functioning in his role.

Biden was still functioning fully in his role in my opinion. What brought him down was the perception of his age while demented Phony Soprano got a pass.

I respect a lot of what Shapiro has done in PA, but he seems a little too "ambitious."

My dad's favorite joke. Terribly sexist - but my mom would laugh at it too. My grade school years were spent with my father yelling at the CBS evening news. He would say when we were doing goofy little kid things "Are you stupid? No. Then why are you acting like a Republican?" He also used to threaten that if we didn't stop acting the fool and going for bad, he would drop us off at the White House and make us live with the Reagans.

But I digress. I mean - I'm over it. Its fine.

On President Biden's worst day - he's better than the syphilis riddled diaper shitting dictator we have now.

When I talk to the ancestors at night - I always ask for The Universe to make sure Biden out lives the maggot.

The reality is this: I'm not down with ANY Black woman having demands placed on her. Once again, we were ignored. Why can't Pete Buttigieg do it? S.O.S. Blinken? Ron Klain?

America needs to read the room that the Democratic Party core base is sitting in. The tolerant welcoming Democrats are down the hall.

This is the cruelty is the point, scorched earth, blind to anything but dominating the opposition tea drinking Club watching America burn until they wake up and Listen To Us This Time.

my mother lost her entire family..my father and two brothers survived...when I was a child my father sat me down in front of our very small television and in his very thick accent demanded I "vatch"...what I watched was a scary man, Joseph McCarthy, yelling at a man sitting across from him.... I remember looking at my father's face, he was crying..and then he put his arms around me and said "This should not happen in America"..

THIS SHOULD NOT HAPPEN IN AMERICA

why she allowed her campaign staff to corral her..

Were Biden's campaign staff.
They were motivated to protect Biden as much as they were to help Harris.

I don't believe he was so impaired that he wasn't engaged. One of Pres. Biden's strengths was picking able people and delegating to them. Whatever his health was or is, it was smart to have experienced people on board and find ways to follow through on the intent.

I also think that Pres. Biden's debate performance did exactly what it was supposed to: make him look like he wouldn't be up to the job and so hand it over to VP Harris. I think at least some of the Democratic voices who criticized President Biden's abilities were trying to reinforce his plan. If I'm right, it was a daring political move that failed. Why did it fail? Because the media is owned by the rich, the rwnj have encroached on elections and voting rights, and hell hell, even the security of the voting machines. Even if Pres. Biden saw a way forward, many in the Democratic party didn't get on board. And of course, like Hillary Clinton, VP Harris is a woman. Oh, the horror of it.

As an aside, VP Harris' choice came down to Walz or Shapiro. How much of this from Shapiro is sour grapes?

I'm alone a lot and maybe my errant thoughts go too far into speculation. But I don't doubt Pres. Biden's political savvy, or his mental acumen.

Biden was all in on support of Bebe Netanyahu. Harris was unable to walk away from that in any meaningful way.
Harris was unable to run her own campaign, in part because of time and because her staff had divided loyalties.
In my opinion Biden was still able to be president but unable to run for president and certainly not at the same time.

Shapiro is not that old, and could run for president in 2032 or 36, after ousting Fetterman.

for ones own ambition isn't right. This is MAGAt style in party politicking and I personally don't like it. We need Fetterman gone (whatever's wrong with him it's not in the country's or his constituents best interest) and I agree, Shapiro would better serve himself by going through the Senate to get into DC. We need all hands on deck to grab these midterms then start worrying about '28. Way to early for this shit. We lose the midterms the country is definitely sunk. And another thing, repukes are making a HARD push for control of enough states to call a convention over the next 3 years and get our Constitution put in a Museum in Idaho somewhere. Full on Pincer move coming at us. We desperately need unity.

They can only propose amendments - ratification by the states is still required.

There won’t be a convention because mathematically, there aren’t enough red states left to reach the threshold to trigger one - they’d need one of the solid blue states to sign on and that’s not going to happen.

Shapiro or Conor Lamb would be my choices to challenge Fetterman in 2028. I've been working on Democratic campaigns here in PA for the past 40 years and I cannot think of a bigger disappointment than John Fetterman. Conor Lamb would have been a much better choice in the 2022 primary.

He probably has his eyes on running for president after that.

It wouldn't surprise me if Conor Lamb took another shot at senate nor would it surprise me if Fetterman elects not to run for a second term.

We know that Josh Shapiro is an effective legislator, but we really need him as an administrator. Namely another term as Governor, and hopefully one day, as President.

I had the chance to hear Conor Lamb speak at a rally this summer and he sounds very good. He's not running for anything yet, but he sure sounds like he could be thinking ahead. I don't know if he would challenge Fetterman directly in a primary, but we'll see. Maybe Fetterman will decide not to run again and leave the path open for Lamb.

given he doesn't show up for committee meetings or even schmooze with his fellow senators.

I'm surprised Conor Lamb has taken a leftward shift away from his moderate instincts lately, but I have to wonder if that''s more out of political convenience than conviction. Lamb's still a relatively young guy, so maybe more life experience has changed his perspective.

Conor Lamb

Then trump, any day, and most of America would agree.

I will never accept trump as my president.

This seems like pandering, and to say this to Stephen A. Smith who is (IMO) an overpaid buffoon is absurd.

If you read all the way down in the article, Kamala Harris said that she thought Biden was absolutely fit and qualified but had a bad debate.

Trump had a bad debate, too, which no one ever mentions.

In her book, she now says

“In retrospect, I think it was recklessness. The stakes were simply too high. This wasn’t a choice that should have been left to an individual’s ego, an individual’s ambition. It should have been more than a personal decision.”

Asking for an open discussion on a topic (Biden's fitness) is not the same as coming down on one side or the other.

Amazing some have the answers to an extremely troublesome conundrum a year later.

You want to have this ambitious president wannabe trashing Democrats for the GOP.

Seems to be our eternal problem. Democrats always blaming Democrats instead of blaming the GOP for what they have done to us.

I don't even know who Stephen A. Smith is, and after this OP never want to hear anything else about him!

nt

but would never have thought he was with ESPN. Thanks. Knowledge is a good thing to collect every day!

He used to be the 76ers beat writer from the Phila Inq.

On ESPN he does one of those two guys shouting at each other shows with Skip Bayless. I think Smith has beocme somewhat of a parody of himself.

he's sounding all butthurt now.

Saying his own ambition and ego would get in the way.

Now Fetterman is this bizarro MAga lite Manchin Sinema wannabe.

And sadly he is my senator. PA suffered a real loss with the defeat of Bob Casey last year. I still cannot believe that the voters chose Trump toady Dave McCormick over Bob Casey. The Casey name has been gold here in PA going back to the 1980s when Casey's father, Bob Casey, Sr., was our 2 term governor.

And it was a BS question. Harris explicitly said in her book that Biden was fit for office. Her criticism of him was many people didn't want him to run because of his age, not his fitness. Harris felt he should have listened to their arguments earlier. The fact that he dropped out eventually reinforced the point that Harris (or whoever) would have had a better chance of winning if they could have campaigned over a longer period of time.

[Note: I don't completely agree with Harris's opinions here, but Smith and apparently Shapiro are twisting what she said into something she didn't say.

that (unfortunately) walked himself right in ...

Foot sighted! Shot same!

Rant
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=3527804
I'm not copying it here.

Image.


Anyone who didn't speak to Joe personally is a coward and has no gripe.
(I don't know who did or didn't)

Life's like that. Really!

Yes there needs to be reflection but airing our party's "dirty laundry" and critizing Biden while Biden is being publicly maligned by prez T is wrong. Even if Joe should have pulled out of the race in 23 or earlier in 24, this isn't the time to give the reich media anything to denegrate us with.

Shapiro just lost my vote.

as a national candidate anyway.
imho.

Don't fall for the distraction.

Joe was a wonderful president and he served the country well for many years. We no longer need postmortems on the 2024 elections. The stakes are too high for the 2026 and 2028 elections. Get over the past and face the scary future.

Im not to happy with Kamala either for the "reckless" thing. Since when is it not the POTUS's decision, alone?

We know who to blame and it ain't Joe Biden or Harris

that the power players in the Democratic Party should have done exactly that in late 2022/early 2023.

that's some powerful imagination ...
A sitting president , and advantage of incumbency - wield rather considerable power ...
The notion that a person in that position should be encouraged (or leveraged) NOT to run ... Is a far, far greater leap.

god knows what sort of hell.

He doesn"t get to tell that Black woman what she has to answer for..
2028 Presidential candidate..
Naw.

Peace, brothers and sisters and all.

But Kamala Harris isn’t one of them.

We now know who followed the money. Keep yourself clean, Josh, because we aren’t as stupid as we seem
and we are looking closely at all of our candidates.

Perhaps he could learn a little.

Save your fight for the MAGATs man. Not our own, and most certainly not Kamala. You're telling on yourself.

One of those things you keep to yourself and never tell anybody. Until, of course, they shoot themselves in the foot.
And this alone is what I didn't trust about him: He was too damn pretty. And a little too full of himself. Period.

Democrats come into office and don't want to find blame," we need to just move on" but a Democrat may possibly may have made a mistake and now we're gonna get to the bottom of this. She's gonna have to answer for this. Meanwhile, our Country is in dire straights, on the verge of a dictatorship and that's what you have to say, Governor?
Well, thanks for playing "who wants to be President. Johnny would you please tell him what his consulation prize is."
You had so much going for you after that bridge success. I won't write him off, but do better.

Asshole. This is what we should be talking about? Our democracy is in peril and he’s talking about the last election? Do ya still have the flag lowered, Shapiro?

And not the full scale fascist takeover of the United States.

I know that this is not the most articulate statement but I am tired of this shit. Just cut the shit out and focus on the real problem - the Felon and his authoritarianism.

Still burying our heads in the sand over the 2024 election I see.

Shapiro to be a *Coastal Elite*. I live in NJ and work in Bucks County PA. Once you leave Philly you are dealing with people who think like they are in Mississippi. Huge Krasnov Displays in their yards, Confederate Flags on their Trucks, etc etc.

He's trying to win Pennsyltucky by leaning in on the bullshit narratives about Harris.

Also - Black Democrats in Newark and Trenton are NOT coastal elites. Neither are Black people in South Carolina.

I'm sick of that. They are sick of that smear.

Whenever the next Presidential election is - the Primary winner will be decided in South Carolina. If Shapiro is running?

He just lost. I don't doubt that Pritzker or Newsom will pummel him with this when they campaign in South Carolina.

Note: I've always listened to Black folks in South Carolina when I cast my Primary vote. It's the only time this country gets to hear about how they are doing in that Figurative Coal Mine. With SC moved up to the front of the line? They send up a prayer to Black Women about the kind of leader they want. They aren't Coastal Elites. They are the Forgotten Women of America.

"I live in NJ and work in Bucks County PA. Once you leave Philly you are dealing with people who think like they are in Mississippi. Huge Krasnov Displays in their yards, Confederate Flags on their Trucks, etc etc".

In my dreams.

For focusing on attacking a Black American woman first.

The ethnic cleansing is here in America now. We intersect with Afro Latino/a. With the exception of one - all of my great nieces and nephews are afro Latino/a. The exception? Her grandparents are from Ivory Coast.

The existential threat is against my flesh and blood in America. I'm putting the oxygen mask on little kids in my family. Everyone else take a ticket and stand in line.

Distance yourself from friends and colleagues who have become targets of your enemy so your enemy won't target you.

Politics is slimey business. Personally, I have been impressed with Shapiro, until this very moment.

Still, I'd vote for him in a light-second if he were running against the Pedo-Fascists.

FFS, isn't there enough R crap to complain about, WTF would you bring down a Dem this way! SMDH.

He just hamstringed himself before it started. Big time.

What a foolish response to a leading question.

any of whom had capacity to discuss.

"... principal officers of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may by law provide." Congress has not provided for another [collective] body of individuals to consider whether the President is able to perform the" powers and duties" of the presidency.

Here's the nuance directly - the VP and all the principal officers of the executive department are in the cabinet. The reverse isn't true since the cabinet includes additional people who are not principal officers. Today, those include key positions such as WH Chief of Staff, DNI, OMB, EPA, SBA, Trade Rep, & CIA. Some cabinets have included UN Ambassador, who is not included today.

the bottom line is, Democratic politicians have to answer for everything, whether they did it or not. And Republican politicians have to answer for nothing.

....regarding his health, she would have spoken out.

As for him running again, she was his VP, not just another Democrat. It was not her decision to make. Had she eeped a word, the press would have made up shit about that.

It wasn't her job. It wasn't her responsibility. It belonged to Biden and the Democrats.

Last edited Sat Sep 20, 2025, 10:01 AM - Edit history (1)

was a great president in some ways. But he appeared to be frail towards the end of his term. Every time he
would speak I would hope he wouldn't have stroke or something, it was obvious he was failing. Someone needed to
convince him not to run. If he would have dropped out there would have been others that would have ran. Kamala Harris had two strikes against her from the start. In my opinion she ran a campaign that turned off many white voters.

those automatically racist /or sexist.

damn what rich, spoiled entertainer endorses what candidate. There are only a few thousand votes in a handful of states that
win or lose an election, we can't afford to turn anyone off. I voted for her but wish there would have been a better choice.

The Republicans seem to like it more than they did whenever they ran Bush, Romney, or McCain. Probably why Trump had some support from mostly male rappers.

I agree about entertainer endorsements whether that is Hollywood or music but I think the Harris campaign went out of their way to avoid offending anyone.

It's populists of another type who put the wealthy and capitalism in the hated "Them" category. Just one of the reasons the hoped for alliance of Right and Left populists won't happen.

There is a healthy type of populism which we had under FDR where they campaigned against bankers and he appointed a head (A Kennedy who turned out to be a better Kennedy than the one in charge of our health) to the United States Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) that went after the cheats and they had very successful election results.

I consider right wing populists you see in Europe and with Trump as well as other countries are very different than like a Bernie Sanders in the US. Big difference between Bolsonaro and Bernie Sanders. The ones that do talk about an alliance with with the far right populists are foolish but those people are rare and tend to be like Jimmy Dore or Cenk Uyger.

but Sanders thinks people voted for Trump because of economic anxiety and all that needs to be done is explain why they're voting against their own economic interests (which he keeps insisting the Democratic Party are ignoring) and they'll vote for left wing populists, the alliance.

But it's an anti-immigrant movement, Republicans created it in the U.S. because they depend on white votes, the threatened white identity base. "It takes a special kind of condescension to believe voters suffering economically are so distracted by the identity politics of the Right that they have overlooked the direct solutions to the economic problems offered by the Left."

"Anyone who wants to explain what's happening in the West needs to answer two simple questions. First, why are right-wing populists doing better than left-wing ones? Second, why did the migration crisis boost populist-right numbers sharply while the economic crisis had no effect? If we stick to data, the answer is crystal clear. Demography and culture, not economic and political developments, hold the key to the populist moment."

Eric Kaufmann

There's a demented loon in the white house right now, and this is what they are talking about?

Kamala "will have to answer for" blah blah...
This is no "purity test". Just a hard pass.
Will support the eventual nominee of course..
..

Trump-- far more impaired (especially ethically) that Joe Biden ever will be-- is well on the way to overturning democracy, and this governor decides he's going to waste his words on the previous president and vice president, neither of whom ever threatened to destroy our government and laws?

To what purpose? What's his plan here?

I for one have a much lower opinion of him now, so if he thinks this will help him in the Dem primary, I think he might be miscalculating. I'm sure I'm not the only primary voter who is grateful to Biden/Harris for restoring our country after the devastation of Trump 1.

I used to respect you up to this point.

Guess it smarts, you asshole. And knowing that you were, at minimum, the THIRD choice must smart even more.

Democrats don't need this shit right now. There is no purpose served by holding on to the past when the present is where everything is on fire. Stupid, stupid man!

Just saying.

They condescendingly assume, no benefit of the doubt: it's going to be whiny sore loser excuses, why is she still around, go away.

Story to tell?

Like we don't have Enough Problems now.. and Divisions in our Democratic Party.

I'd like to hear from Kama on this!

This knnda looks like sour grapes.

There's midterms coming up and that is where our focus needs to be.


That, and EPSTEIN!