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riversedge

(78,948 posts)
Sat Nov 22, 2025, 09:54 PM Nov 22

Trump and Prince Had 'Disturbing' Call After Khashoggi's Murder, Lawmaker Says

Source: nytimes.com



Representative Eugene Vindman of Virginia said he reviewed a classified transcript of the 2019 conversation that would “shock” Americans.

Robert Jimison Nov. 22, 2025, 10:24 a.m. ET

Representative Eugene Vindman, Democrat of Virginia, called on Friday for the declassification of what he described as a “highly disturbing” 2019 phone call between President Trump and Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman of Saudi Arabia after the murder of the journalist Jamal Khashoggi.

At a news conference on Capitol Hill with Mr. Khashoggi’s widow, Mr. Vindman said that the transcript, which he reviewed as part of his duties serving on the National Security Council during Mr. Trump's first term, “would shock people if they knew what was said.”

He said it was one of two disturbing phone call transcripts he had read during his time in the first Trump administration, the other being the 2019 call with Ukraine’s president that became the basis of a whistle-blower complaint involving his twin brother, Alexander Vindman, that led to Mr. Trump’s first impeachment.


Mr. Vindman did not divulge what was said in the call between Mr. Trump and Prince Mohammed, who U.S. intelligence concluded approved the killing. But in a letter to Mr. Trump on Thursday, he and dozens of other House Democrats demanded its release. That push is exceedingly unlikely to succeed, and the Virginia Democrat’s announcement appeared calculated mostly to intensify political pressure on the president and keep attention on the killing of Mr. Khashoggi............................

Read more: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/21/us/politics/trump-saudi-crown-prince-khashoggi.html






Trump and Prince Had ‘Disturbing’ Call After Khashoggi’s Murder, Lawmaker Says

www.nytimes.com/2025/11/21/u...

(@oceancalm.bsky.social) 2025-11-23T02:53:01.019Z


Representative Eugene Vindman, Democrat of Virginia, called for the declassification of a 2019 conversation between Trump and Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman of Saudi Arabia which took place shortly after the murder of journalist Jamal Khashoggi. Credit...Anna Rose Layden for The New York Times
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Trump and Prince Had 'Disturbing' Call After Khashoggi's Murder, Lawmaker Says (Original Post) riversedge Nov 22 OP
My guess: Prince Bonesaw sent Trump a digital copy of film of the murder Attilatheblond Nov 22 #1
Christ. I would not be surprised a bit Ishoutandscream2 Sunday #9
Good, keep up the pressure. Don't let the giant orange asshole rest. Walleye Nov 22 #2
Paywall-free link to article pat_k Nov 22 #3
Trump probably told him he wish he could do the same to his enemies drray23 Nov 22 #4
K & R! lastlib Nov 22 #5
The entire Democratic Conference should join in the demand for a release. pat_k Nov 22 #6
Where are . . . AverageOldGuy Sunday #7
What did Bone Sawltan and Rump say? Blumancru Sunday #8

Attilatheblond

(7,925 posts)
1. My guess: Prince Bonesaw sent Trump a digital copy of film of the murder
Sat Nov 22, 2025, 10:05 PM
Nov 22

and Trump was fan-boying 'the fun movie'.

Ishoutandscream2

(6,770 posts)
9. Christ. I would not be surprised a bit
Sun Nov 23, 2025, 12:02 PM
Sunday

I think the orange blob would absolutely love watching a video of that.

drray23

(8,544 posts)
4. Trump probably told him he wish he could do the same to his enemies
Sat Nov 22, 2025, 10:21 PM
Nov 22

and asked for tips. Maybe if he could borrow his bonesaw guy for a bit..

pat_k

(12,569 posts)
6. The entire Democratic Conference should join in the demand for a release.
Sat Nov 22, 2025, 11:15 PM
Nov 22

Article conclusion

Asked why he had not demanded the transcript’s release sooner, Mr. Vindman said the political context has fundamentally shifted.

“Up to this point, M.B.S. was a pariah,” he said. “Now the president is trying to whitewash everything. The benefits the Trump family reaped would become much clearer if that transcript were released.”


Under claims of executive privlledge the regime will block efforts. But isn't it time to compile a list of executive privlledge abuses and start a drumbeat for a constitutional amendment that severely limits the scope of presidential immunity and executive privlledge ?

It is time for a drumbeat from We the People to push our elected to advocate NOW, loud and proud, for a constitutional amendment to severely limit executive privilege and to severely limit presidential immunity..

I know that some object to AI, so take the following with the skepticism you would bring to any AI answer, but this is what Gemini delivered to today in response to the following questions:

Describe a constitutional amendment that a functioning American constitutional democracy could enact to severely limit the scope of executive privilege

A constitutional amendment to severely limit the scope of executive privilege could establish a statutory basis for the privilege while explicitly defining its boundaries and reinforcing judicial and congressional oversight. The current privilege is an implied power based on separation of powers and relies on a judicial balancing test, so a constitutional amendment would provide explicit, codified restrictions.

A possible amendment could be structured as follows:

Proposed Constitutional Amendment Text

Section 1: Establishment of Qualified Executive Privilege

The President shall have a qualified privilege to withhold certain confidential communications and information from the Legislative and Judicial Branches. This privilege is not absolute and may be overcome by a compelling public interest in disclosure.


Section 2: Limitations and Exceptions

Executive privilege shall not extend to the following:

Evidence of criminal conduct: Information, documents, or communications that contain evidence of a violation of federal, state, or local criminal law by any executive branch official, including the President and Vice President.

Matters of impeachment: Any information deemed necessary and proper by the House of Representatives for the purpose of an impeachment inquiry or by the Senate for an impeachment trial.

Congressional oversight: Information demanded by a a valid congressional subpoena, unless the Executive Branch can demonstrate, to a court established under Article III, that the disclosure would compromise ongoing military or diplomatic operations in a manner that gravely threatens national security. A generalized interest in confidentiality shall not be sufficient to override a compelling congressional need for information.

Personal matters: Communications or documents related primarily to the President's personal, political, or private interests, and not to the core constitutional duties of the Presidency.


Section 3: Judicial Review

Any dispute regarding the assertion of executive privilege shall be subject to expedited judicial review. An Article III court shall be the final arbiter of whether the privilege has been appropriately invoked, applying a balancing test that gives paramount weight to the need for evidence in criminal proceedings and the public interest in transparency and accountability.


Section 4: Penalties and Enforcement

Congress shall have the power to enforce the provisions of this article through appropriate legislation, including penalties for officials who unlawfully withhold information.


This amendment moves executive privilege from an implied constitutional power to a codified, statutory right with clear limitations, ensuring it does not shield the President from accountability or the law.


Describe a constitutional amendment that a functioning American constitutional democracy could enact to severely limit the scope of presidential immunity

A constitutional amendment could severely limit presidential immunity by clarifying that the President is not immune from criminal prosecution for any violation of federal law, regardless of whether the act was "official" or "unofficial". Such an amendment could explicitly prevent self-pardons and ban pardons for the President's family, administration officials, and anyone whose crimes were committed to advance the President's personal interests. This would correct a legal interpretation that grants presidents presumptive immunity for official acts and would ensure that all individuals, including the President, are equally subject to the law.

Key provisions to include:

No immunity for criminal acts: A constitutional amendment could state that no officer of the United States, including the President and Vice President, shall be immune from criminal prosecution for any violation of federal law. This would reverse the Supreme Court's decision to grant presidents presumptive immunity for official acts.

End self-pardon power: The amendment could explicitly prohibit the President from granting a pardon to themselves.
Limit pardons for others: It could bar the President from pardoning family members, administration officials, and campaign employees, especially if the crimes committed were to advance the President's personal interests.

Clarify "official acts": The amendment could provide a clear definition or a mechanism to distinguish between a president's official duties and their private conduct, preventing the executive branch from claiming immunity for acts that fall outside of their constitutional responsibilities.


How it would work:

Leveling the playing field: By removing presidential immunity, this amendment would ensure that no individual, even the president, is above the law and can be held accountable for criminal actions.

Restoring checks and balances: This would restore the balance of power by preventing the presidency from operating with impunity and ensuring that the judicial branch has the authority to prosecute the president for crimes committed while in office.

Deterring future abuses: The knowledge that they could be prosecuted for criminal acts would deter presidents from engaging in such behavior and protect democratic institutions from being undermined.



AverageOldGuy

(3,208 posts)
7. Where are . . .
Sun Nov 23, 2025, 12:22 AM
Sunday

. . . all the leakers when we need them?

I mean, the national sport of DC is leaking sensitive information.

Vindman was an Army lieutenant colonel -- a Ukrainian and Russian linguist -- serving as a department chief on the National Security Council. If he had access to transcript(s) of the Trump-MBS phone call, so did a lot of other people. Just as the Trump-Zelensky phone call was leaked leading to Trump's first impeachment, so the Trump-MBS transcript just may be slipped to a NYT reporter.

NOTE: Vindman, his twin brother, and their older brother were born in Ukraine in 1975 (?) when Ukraine was part of Russia. After their mother died, their father brought the boys to the US. All the sons did well in college. The twins went into the Army, both served in the infantry, Eugene (the Congressman) was wounded in Iraq. Both were assigned to the National Security Council during Trump's first term. Both were selected for promotion to Colonel, however, after Lt Col Eugene Vindman's testimony revealing details of the Trump-Zelensky phone call, Trump ordered both Vindman's removed from the Colonel's promotion list, forcing both to retire from the Army as Lieutenant Colonels, instead of as Colonels, as they both had earned.

Do I sound bitter? Goddam right I am. I'm a Vietnam vet and a retired Army officer, active duty 1967-1995. Cadet Bone Spurs is not fit to clean out my latrine. Do I hate Trump with a hatred that burns hotter than a thousand suns? How did you guess? At age 81 next month, I hope to live long enough to piss on Trump's grave, even if it means standing in line all day.

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