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mahatmakanejeeves

(67,664 posts)
Tue Nov 25, 2025, 07:24 AM Tuesday

Dear JAG: What Do I Do if I Get Unlawful Orders to Blow Up Civilian Boats

Hat tip, commenter Coram Nobis et seq at Joe.My.God.

https://www.joemygod.com/2025/11/mark-kelly-to-hegseth-i-wont-be-silenced-by-bullies/#comment-6801125369

Mark Kelly To Hegseth: I Won’t Be “Silenced By Bullies”
November 24, 2025

Jurisprudence

Dear JAG: What Do I Do if I Get Unlawful Orders to Blow Up Civilian Boats

By Eugene R. Fidell and Steven J. Lepper
Nov 24, 2025 2:38 PM


“Dear Joe.” Martin Bernetti/AFP via Getty Images

This month saw another deadly U.S. military strike on a civilian vessel, suspected of drug trafficking, in international waters. As these strikes have escalated, questions have only increased around their lawfulness. At the same time, President Donald Trump last week accused Democratic lawmakers of “treason” for producing a viral video noting that members of the military must remain vigilant in the face of potentially unlawful orders from the commander in chief. On Monday, the Pentagon announced it was investigating Sen. Mark Kelly for the video about unlawful orders.

As a former judge advocate in the Coast Guard and a retired Air Force major general who served as deputy legal counsel to the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and deputy judge advocate general of the Air Force, we offer some perspective on how members of the military can and should respond to such orders.

The following “Dear Joe” email exchange is a hypothetical email colloquy between an expert in military law and a fictional service member seeking advice on how to deal with the current situation. The content is based on publicly reported facts, the Manual for Courts-Martial, the Uniform Code of Military Justice, and the authors’ opinions.

Military law establishes a strong presumption that military orders are lawful and must be obeyed. We do not counsel any military member to disobey any order they may be given. Our purpose is simply to provide all readers insight into the laws and procedures associated with military orders and the challenges involved in identifying, questioning, and disobeying orders that are unlawful.

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Dear JAG: What Do I Do if I Get Unlawful Orders to Blow Up Civilian Boats (Original Post) mahatmakanejeeves Tuesday OP
That's all, not very reassuring! essaynnc Tuesday #1
I can imagine a dilemma if unlawful orders are given, and no_hypocrisy Tuesday #2
The MAGA JAGs have already given legal cover to those involved in the Caribbean attacks. Fiendish Thingy Tuesday #3

essaynnc

(955 posts)
1. That's all, not very reassuring!
Tue Nov 25, 2025, 07:47 AM
Tuesday

Aside from lots of legal mumbo jumbo, the conclusions are pretty vague also. If you think it's illegal, complain to your superior and hope that it goes up the food chain and is reversed. If that doesn't work, be assured that in Nuremberg it was the higher levels who got in trouble, not the grunts. Sleep well! Conscious be damned!

no_hypocrisy

(53,877 posts)
2. I can imagine a dilemma if unlawful orders are given, and
Tue Nov 25, 2025, 07:56 AM
Tuesday

service members have a strong basis not to obey them --- and they're threatened with court martial if they DON'T obey the unlawful orders.

Remember that the military is based on uniformity. You might have a few individuals have the courage and integrity to refuse to follow unlawful orders, but they won't necessarily find followers amongst their ranks.

Fiendish Thingy

(21,661 posts)
3. The MAGA JAGs have already given legal cover to those involved in the Caribbean attacks.
Tue Nov 25, 2025, 09:46 AM
Tuesday

Hegseth made sure he got rid of any lawyers with a conscience.

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