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GreatGazoo

(4,180 posts)
Tue Sep 16, 2025, 08:36 AM Tuesday

Henry Hudson's Progeny Forced to Live in Muncie Indiana? The Sept 15th Log Entry

Two highly debated days of Henry Hudson's river exploration are September 15 and 16. Every town in our area claims to be the place that Hudson stopped to fish on these days and found "very loving people" -- "Dutchman's Landing" in Catskill, the city named "Hudson", etc.

The log of the Half Moon was written by Juet, a paranoid, murderous Englishman, likely 50+ years of age. Unlike Verrazzano, who loved the tall naked women of Manhattan, Juet never describes the people they encounter, only their actions:

"The fifteenth, in the morning was misty untill the Sunne arose: then it cleered. So wee weighed with the wind at South, and ran up into the River twentie leagues, passing by high Mountaines. Wee had a very good depth...and great store of Salmons in the River. "


Two men that Hudson and Juet had kidnapped escaped by jumping out a small window on the ship and dropping about 10-feet to the river:

"This morning our two Savages got out of a Port and swam away. After we were under sayle, they called to us in scorne. "


Juet writes this like it is just another day at work. It is the only time he uses the word "savage" so some have theorized that Juet is compensating. He has been bested by these people so he goes for the slur. Hudson and Juet tried over and over to abduct men on their way up river but they are like the coyote in Roadrunner cartoons. In a modern perspective their actions are not just morally abhorrent but really stupid because they will eventually have to go back down river past the groups that these men were taken from. The heroification version of English history generally omits Juet's actions and says things like "they had trouble with the Indians".

Finally we come to the mouth of the Esopus at Saugerties, an excellent place to fish because of the short 4-foot waterfall which traps fish in between tides. Try to catch what Juet slips in here:

"At night we came to other Mountaines, which lie from the Rivers side. There wee found very loving people, and very old men: where wee were well used. Our Boat went to fish, and caught great store of very good fish."


Hmmm..."very loving people" but "very old men" so "we were well used". In other words they had sex, lots of sex in Saugerties. It is entirely possible that Hudson's great grandchildren were among the Munsee who were forced off this land and driven all the way to Muncie Indiana.

I visited this spot last night. It was very interesting to walk through this spot on the calendar day that matches the log and in similar weather. Many of the views seem unchanged in 400 years but I am not sure that the area of the lighthouse was always land-bridged to the western shore of the river. I need to see it at high tide.

The spot is now a B&B lighthouse. Still a place for "very loving people":

"If there's anything more romantic than the Saugerties Lighthouse, I simply don't know what it could be. We have no interest in leaving the lighthouse. Ever."


https://www.saugertieslighthouse.com/
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Henry Hudson's Progeny Forced to Live in Muncie Indiana? The Sept 15th Log Entry (Original Post) GreatGazoo Tuesday OP
That sounds to me to be a very bad outcome... NNadir Tuesday #1

NNadir

(36,584 posts)
1. That sounds to me to be a very bad outcome...
Tue Sep 16, 2025, 08:48 AM
Tuesday

...being forced to live in Muncie Indiana.

All joking aside, the treatment of native Ameicans by the European Sea pirates is a historical tragedy that can never ve undone.

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