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ITAL

(1,148 posts)

5. To a certain degree it can only be an art

Reply to GreatGazoo (Original post)

Wed Jul 30, 2025, 03:10 PM

Wednesday

There are facts of course (such and such happened on whatever day), but much of history will always be debated or viewed through various prisms. Is history as a contest between oppressors and oppressed (and all the various subgroups of that, like men/women or colonialist, etc.) as some say, or is there more nuance? Do leaders lead really popular movements and shape opinion, or do they generally follow the popular zeitgeist (hence leaders aren't actually that important) whatever it is?

Historians will often disagree on what makes a great president or a top general (or nearly as often WHO was a great president or general), and often what traits work for one person won't work for another. Why is that? Just circumstance?

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Highlight:

Why Is So Much of What We Call "History" Wrong? [View all] GreatGazoo Wednesday OP

The "winners" write it. H2O Man Wednesday #1

This NewHendoLib Wednesday #2

That, and the fact that most people don't give a damn thucythucy Wednesday #4

"How much do we devote, yearly, to the preservation..."? Billions of $$$ GreatGazoo Wednesday #7

I specifically tried to exclude tourism and tourist attractions, thucythucy Wednesday #15

I hear you on NFL expenses vs history preservation GreatGazoo Wednesday #17

Americans are more interested in science fiction than history. thought crime Wednesday #18

That simple malaise Wednesday #8

Not always TnDem Wednesday #12

But which "holy" texts were chosen to be included in the Bible, Aristus Wednesday #16

The Bible isn't history. thought crime Wednesday #19

"Nobody reads anymore." Kid Berwyn 15 hrs ago #27

;--{) Goonch 15 hrs ago #28

Countering Criticism of the Warren Report (CIA, PDF) Kid Berwyn 13 hrs ago #29

There are no facts. Only interpretations. Friedrich Nietzsche Ping Tung Wednesday #3

This message was self-deleted by its author thought crime Wednesday #20

To a certain degree it can only be an art ITAL Wednesday #5

"Why it happened" is much more debatable than 'What happened' GreatGazoo Wednesday #6

Nice OP malaise Wednesday #9

Ironically, your version of the scan of Shakespeare's grave is completely wrong muriel_volestrangler Wednesday #10

GPR shows no skull, no casket or coffin, not even nails from a rotted coffin. GreatGazoo Wednesday #11

The irony of your attempt to spin this against the reality is quite hilarious muriel_volestrangler Wednesday #13

I cited the Shakespeare myth specifically for the dynamic you are helping to illustrate GreatGazoo Wednesday #14

Sure, go on denying what the people who did the scan said, if it makes you feel OK muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #22

Kevin Colls says there is no skull under that stone and no coffin GreatGazoo 22 hrs ago #23

So we've gone from "Shakespeare isn't buried there. It's empty" to 5, including him, buried in shallow graves in shrouds muriel_volestrangler 20 hrs ago #24

According to Colls and science, Is Shakespeare's skull in that infant-sized "grave"? Yes or No GreatGazoo 15 hrs ago #25

They don't know if the skull is in there or not, but the grave is not "infant-sized" muriel_volestrangler 13 hrs ago #30

SInce you mentioned "Gilgamesh", I'll leave you this historical tidbit: Gilgamesh gave birth to Hamas. RedWhiteBlueIsRacist Wednesday #21

Well said! nt intrepidity 15 hrs ago #26