General Discussion

patrice

(47,992 posts)

76. Guess what, to me, this isn't even that much about him. To me, it's about the best chances

Fri Dec 16, 2011, 04:14 AM

Dec 2011

we have had for a long time to significantly increase the right to organize and maybe even EFCA 2.0 and it's about the best chance we have had ever for Expanded and Improved Medicare for All, HR 676, or some version thereof. It's also the most crucial point to act in support of alternative energy and environmental protection. It's now, or an entirely different kind of chances, if any at all, in '16 or '20.

All of which possibilities all you all can kiss goodbye if we fail in the executive or legislative efforts in 2012 and turning folks off to Obama is a sure-fire way to make that happen, so pardon me if I wonder about all of this concern for our agenda relative to PO the weakling, when there's no more sure death to our agenda than 4-8 years of some Royal Repuglycan Jerk.

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Seriously, did so many people truly believe that president Obama could change the course.... [View all] WCGreen Dec 2011 OP

I really didn't expect a quick switch TlalocW Dec 2011 #1

He is pretty adept at navagating through the mine field... WCGreen Dec 2011 #5

I'm tired of posts like the OP. How is signing the indefinite detention bill a problem for him? roguevalley Dec 2011 #158

+1 eom Beam Me Up Dec 2011 #177

+1, Agreed & Well Said! Sherman A1 Dec 2011 #183

Obama acquired his Keepers Zalatix Dec 2011 #212

There was no such bill Anatos Dec 2011 #228

There is no question that he was handed a huge mess, for sure. CaliforniaPeggy Dec 2011 #2

Yes! I will not!! forget how his own party has not been up to the challenge. patrice Dec 2011 #9

Some of us were kenfrequed Dec 2011 #174

hmmm, just a thought BlancheSplanchnik Dec 2011 #22

yes, obama doesnt have the b pulpit. OWS has been the only thing louder than talk radio last 20 yrs certainot Dec 2011 #148

yep..finding ways to break through the wall of noise is paramount right now. BlancheSplanchnik Dec 2011 #213

thanks for reminding me- he's a hero for exposing all that although the swiftboating of anita hill certainot Dec 2011 #215

Thank you, Blanche, for saying what I was thinking. japple Dec 2011 #178

one of my little known talents BlancheSplanchnik Dec 2011 #214

You don't really think polmaven Dec 2011 #150

An unfortunate, succinctly stated, truth, that. nt MADem Dec 2011 #173

President Obama Accomplished A Lot In The Three Years He's Been At The Helm...... global1 Dec 2011 #3

That and the alternative is not an option... WCGreen Dec 2011 #10

Right ON madokie Dec 2011 #97

From day#1, what calls itself "the Left" screamed at him to fight AND pulled the rug out patrice Dec 2011 #4

No, we thought he would stand up for us Cronus Protagonist Dec 2011 #6

This assumes that YOUR definition of "stand up" is THE valid one, even though it patrice Dec 2011 #15

We liberals failed to stand up for us, too. Zalatix Dec 2011 #216

No, I seriously believed he would try. That's all. Try, stand up, that's all. (nt) enough Dec 2011 #7

That's what I expected too. hifiguy Dec 2011 #116

I'm glad he didn't Anatos Dec 2011 #229

Did I "truly believe"? No. Did I "hope"? Damn straight! nt jtrockville Dec 2011 #8

Agreed. patrice Dec 2011 #186

Sad to see you buying into this straw-man argument. It was never the speed, it was the direction. Maven Dec 2011 #11

There it is. Many will keep pushing the didn't do enough theme just to avoid this TheKentuckian Dec 2011 #16

X2 -- Absolutely right AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #117

I agree. nm rhett o rick Dec 2011 #164

I believe Anatos Dec 2011 #230

Not over the blow job, I don't think that is gemane to public affairs. TheKentuckian Dec 2011 #234

Not germaine Anatos Dec 2011 #235

You guess wrong and quite poorly based on your own preconceptions. I am no Clintonite TheKentuckian Dec 2011 #240

We truly don't know what went on behind the closed when they all met about the WCGreen Dec 2011 #20

Well we do know that he told the Banksters Bluenorthwest Dec 2011 #95

We didn't elect him Anatos Dec 2011 #231

+1. Couldn't be said any better. Dawgs Dec 2011 #105

thank you! newspeak Dec 2011 #123

"It was never the speed, it was the direction." Well said. And WTF? Jeff Immelt? nm rhett o rick Dec 2011 #163

I believed he and a Democratic Congress could change the direction of the mmonk Dec 2011 #12

He did change the direction of previous years, yes. Anatos Dec 2011 #236

My piss poor attitude is attributable to a few very real things. mmonk Dec 2011 #237

Post removed Post removed Dec 2011 #238

k&r... spanone Dec 2011 #13

Fixing this country and changing DC will take at least 3 Presidents, all on the same page. FarLeftFist Dec 2011 #14

Funny how so many harp on how profound the corruption is, but this guy, for some reason, is patrice Dec 2011 #17

that's human nature, thinking that way. BlancheSplanchnik Dec 2011 #25

So because corruption is "profound," he doesn't even have to try? ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #50

I think it is wrong to assume there's 1 & only 1 definition of "try" and that definition is 100% patrice Dec 2011 #52

Wow, you're almost as good as the Rape-Publicans at saying that nothing means anything... ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #58

Your saying that that way, doesn't make anything I said less true. Tell me there's ONE and only one patrice Dec 2011 #59

It doesn't make anything you said any less convoluted, either. ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #62

Sorry. Reality IS complex. Oversimplifications are in error. patrice Dec 2011 #69

Of course it is. For example, "complex" and "convoluted" may sound similar... ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #73

So, reality isn't convoluted? All relationships, especially financial ones, are direct and simple? patrice Dec 2011 #78

Wow! Estevan Dec 2011 #135

Funny, if 'profound corruption' is the problem Bluenorthwest Dec 2011 #96

No that's YOUR theory. I have said elsewhere, the situation is much more complex and convoluted patrice Dec 2011 #120

Hpothetical: President gets on tv & makes references to "profound corruption"; what happens next? patrice Dec 2011 #125

it seems the MO newspeak Dec 2011 #134

It's going to take a hell of a lot more than that if the first three are as timid... ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #51

That's what I've said from day #1 of his election! Ship of Fools Dec 2011 #110

No, absolutely no one believed that. JoeyT Dec 2011 #18

WTF??? "absolutely no one"??? LINK please! patrice Dec 2011 #147

The bigger question is did he really want to change the course? Now lets be teddy51 Dec 2011 #19

Well, I never had really high expectations.. WCGreen Dec 2011 #23

Yeah, and no one talks about the difference between experiencing that campaign & being surprised patrice Dec 2011 #189

Being surprised, especially as a Senator, is evidence of wrongheaded thinking. TheKentuckian Dec 2011 #226

But Fox News promised us he would be the most liberal president in history! JohnnyRingo Dec 2011 #21

Faux didn't have to. Obama did plenty to encourage that impression on his own. ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #45

I know you're disappointed. JohnnyRingo Dec 2011 #81

This is exactly what is needed... Ineeda Dec 2011 #93

Union since age 20 Bluenorthwest Dec 2011 #100

What?!!! JohnnyRingo Dec 2011 #143

I think you misinterpreted his/her post. They were posting what Republicans would say about it stevenleser Dec 2011 #165

?????????????????? Are you confused? patrice Dec 2011 #191

1+++++++++ patrice Dec 2011 #190

I am far more cynical than that nadinbrzezinski Dec 2011 #24

No, but either *he* did or he was lying. Donald Ian Rankin Dec 2011 #26

Even FDR only halved unemployment in his first term. MannyGoldstein Dec 2011 #27

Your facts are close to right, but consider the context Yo_Mama Dec 2011 #34

So at what point can we declare that the bottom occurred *this* time? MannyGoldstein Dec 2011 #35

Close to right is as near as anyone can get Yo_Mama Dec 2011 #41

Do you believe that the official unemployment number is valid? MannyGoldstein Dec 2011 #46

It's not invalid, but it doesn't tell the whole picture by a long shot. Yo_Mama Dec 2011 #53

If he wanted no part of Bush..... izquierdista Dec 2011 #28

It's a lot harder than you think to completely purge an administration from the prior one.... WCGreen Dec 2011 #29

He didn't even try izquierdista Dec 2011 #33

No it is not. He intentionally appointed 'a team of rivals' Bluenorthwest Dec 2011 #102

you do remember when little boots-cheney newspeak Dec 2011 #138

Toxic Financial Sector. You have to get the best possible inside information about their problems & patrice Dec 2011 #61

Who would be better? Obviously, those who did not help the crash. Obvious to some. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #131

I want to see the wreckage re-built/recycled into profit-sharing & various forms of co - operatives. patrice Dec 2011 #145

I want to see banksters on their way to Texas prisons, without air-conditioning. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #175

I didn't, and I'm surprised he's gotten anything at all done... TreasonousBastard Dec 2011 #30

"I never believed that president Obama was the Messiah who would take us to the Promised Land" Bonobo Dec 2011 #31

If you are refering to the son of the al qaeda member Bodhi BloodWave Dec 2011 #85

"Republicans, from the very start thucythucy Dec 2011 #32

. XemaSab Dec 2011 #43

Yeah, what you said Lydia Leftcoast Dec 2011 #49

GREAT post. Says everything I've felt over the last few years, as I've watched this president Demit Dec 2011 #108

Best Post I've seen ... Martin Eden Dec 2011 #137

Why not "do what's right and . . ?" because his/our enemies CAN punish him by HURTING people. patrice Dec 2011 #192

I think I understand your point, thucythucy Dec 2011 #209

I honestly don't know why you bothered DevonRex Dec 2011 #36

And has managed an impressive amount of accomplishments in spite of all that. CakeGrrl Dec 2011 #37

Wow, it seems like all you talk about is a primary challenge to Obama. ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #48

Obama has already changed the way Washington works. Major Hogwash Dec 2011 #38

The legislative process is quite a bit more transparent than it was, but still not enough. patrice Dec 2011 #55

TBH, I'm not quite as optimistic as you are, but........ AverageJoe90 Dec 2011 #89

No, but i did think he'd try donheld Dec 2011 #39

I think we're all fucked no matter what Taverner Dec 2011 #40

That's what happens when you convince someone that you'll do something. ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #42

In fact, this thread is a good example of the "Flounder Syndrome." ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #44

I expected him to TRY Lydia Leftcoast Dec 2011 #47

Like it or not, his job was not to tip the train-wreck teetering on the edge of the cliff patrice Dec 2011 #54

patrice his job was to save it HangOnKids Dec 2011 #56

Tell me exactly how he could have gotten precisely the PRIVATE BUSINESS information he needed patrice Dec 2011 #64

He is the Pesident patrice HangOnKids Dec 2011 #67

Yeah, once again we're told he's ALL POWERFUL... or he's totally powerless... ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #70

"told he's ALL POWERFUL"?? LINK please. patrice Dec 2011 #193

Wow. You really do think he's a king. Wonder how the U.S.A. will feel when he orders PRIVATE patrice Dec 2011 #80

King? HangOnKids Dec 2011 #82

So you're going to discount the effects of MSM propaganda & commercialism? All Americans have patrice Dec 2011 #122

Post removed Post removed Dec 2011 #124

Insults are the inevitable recourse of the weak. patrice Dec 2011 #126

Post removed Post removed Dec 2011 #127

If you don't understand, perhaps a question is in order. That is unless, your patrice Dec 2011 #129

So you prefer a culture of victimhood? patrice Dec 2011 #128

What the hell are you talking about? ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #57

The edge of a cliff thing HangOnKids Dec 2011 #60

Yeah. But admitting that doesn't keep Dems divided. ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #63

Victimhood again. What about autonomy? Those who do not WANT to be divided will NOT patrice Dec 2011 #156

You are assuming that YOU know with 100% validity what to hold him accountable for. patrice Dec 2011 #149

So, let it all go over into the abyss and THAT way we'll know for sure what of our financial patrice Dec 2011 #66

Again, what the hell are you talking about? ClassWarrior Dec 2011 #68

Private conversation in her head sums it up HangOnKids Dec 2011 #75

Our economy IS being held hostage, is it not? patrice Dec 2011 #77

Flubber and The Pit? WTF? HangOnKids Dec 2011 #72

to be perfectly honest,,,,he is doing pretty much what I expected..I knew he was a centrist Douglas Carpenter Dec 2011 #65

When you campaign on hope people are going to be left disappointed... Fearless Dec 2011 #71

You need to get a grip on the situation. First of all, the President got an anti-gay guy akbacchus_BC Dec 2011 #74

Guess what, to me, this isn't even that much about him. To me, it's about the best chances patrice Dec 2011 #76

Bet you know that more people you insure, the cost will be less ... Why the US does not have single akbacchus_BC Dec 2011 #79

I thought I was done for the night thucythucy Dec 2011 #210

"I think president Obama is doing the best he can" progressoid Dec 2011 #83

Well said. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #119

NOT true. I'm amazed you think he couldn't have done the war better. Assuming it was a given for him patrice Dec 2011 #152

The purpose of that war was not "WIN IRAQ" a simple pattern Dec 2011 #170

yeah, little boots did the best he could newspeak Dec 2011 #225

i've been disappointed, but maybe i expected too much. DesertFlower Dec 2011 #84

Highly Recommended! DeathToTheOil Dec 2011 #86

no, it's more like charlie having the football taken away newspeak Dec 2011 #136

I think having that much wool over your eyes would be very itchy. harmonicon Dec 2011 #87

It's only rationalizing when the other guy does it. (google Attribution Error in Social Psychology). patrice Dec 2011 #195

I mostly agree, although I believe Obama needs to start stepping up and KICKING ASS a little more... AverageJoe90 Dec 2011 #88

I expected Obama to DO what Obama SAID HE WOULD DO. period. 99th_Monkey Dec 2011 #90

+1 deutsey Dec 2011 #92

He's pretty much been what I expected, unfortunately deutsey Dec 2011 #91

There's really no need to patronize - TBF Dec 2011 #94

No, but I at least thought he'd try. Myrina Dec 2011 #98

We'll never know what he could have convinced the Democratic majority to do eomer Dec 2011 #99

He did promise to change the way we do business in DC WCGreen Dec 2011 #107

A foolish promise (or a disingenuous one), followed by a predictable result. eomer Dec 2011 #159

Nobody hear stated changing the country would be as easy as flipping a switch fascisthunter Dec 2011 #101

i've seen it implied often. it was primary framing for the RW media as soon as obama got in certainot Dec 2011 #151

1+++++++++++++ but I don't know whether to be happy or sad that they're hanging with us. patrice Dec 2011 #196

feel free to come out and accuse me of such a thing.... instead of implying it fascisthunter Dec 2011 #198

you wrote NO ONE here - i didn't imply anything about you certainot Dec 2011 #211

sorry certainot fascisthunter Dec 2011 #218

No, I never expected overnite success. Wait Wut Dec 2011 #103

You speak very precisely for me. That's exactly my experience. patrice Dec 2011 #200

Nope, starting with the McClurkin hate rallies Bluenorthwest Dec 2011 #104

It's his judgement and lack of fight, not the results. Dawgs Dec 2011 #106

well said, Mr. Green Tuesday Afternoon Dec 2011 #109

He not only hasn't changed course, he has gone full speed ahead on some of the worst Bush Era abuses MNBrewer Dec 2011 #111

I didn't expect an overnight cure-all to 20-30 years of bad policies and bad decisions- Proud Liberal Dem Dec 2011 #112

Re Gitmo. I saw an analysis the other night, from a reliable source patrice Dec 2011 #202

I didn't realize that Proud Liberal Dem Dec 2011 #217

Yeah, he lacked the fortitude and will to just move or start trial proceedings TheKentuckian Dec 2011 #241

Right on the money krucial Dec 2011 #113

Re his getting ripped by Repukes: I think they're getting even for what a miserable fucking piece of patrice Dec 2011 #203

Yes . . . with Obama-for-America he could have mistertrickster Dec 2011 #114

What would have satisfied me - bhikkhu Dec 2011 #115

No Republicans, racists or otherwise, forced him to choose Timothy Geithner. That just 1 example. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #118

You do understand the nature of our particular corruption, don't you? Republicans aren't patrice Dec 2011 #121

"our particular corruption"? What do you mean "our," Kemo Sabe. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #132

Unless you're living completely off of "the grid" & surviving entirely on your own abilities, patrice Dec 2011 #144

I voted for him thinking he would try to stand up to that corruption, not use it as an excuse. n/t totodeinhere Dec 2011 #140

no, but i expected a difference shanti Dec 2011 #130

You can't undo 30-50 years of harm in four years. Orsino Dec 2011 #133

Nope had no hopes of that... SomethingFishy Dec 2011 #139

Certainly not. Centrists like Obama are too fond of the status quo. Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2011 #141

"how violent the reaction was to President Obama from the start" hfojvt Dec 2011 #142

It wasn't Bush's methods we objected to, it was the POLICIES yurbud Dec 2011 #146

What? Obama gave up on us FROM THE GET GO!! Roland99 Dec 2011 #153

a lot of new voters fell into the trap of high expectations set by the right media, espec RW radio certainot Dec 2011 #154

He's not doing the best he CAN. Cheap_Trick Dec 2011 #155

AND they CAN do a LOT more than just shoot a President, like start more wars and such. patrice Dec 2011 #157

then if that is the case newspeak Dec 2011 #224

They knew NNN0LHI Dec 2011 #160

Not a Liberal krucial Dec 2011 #161

I think he is what he does, and a lot of that is substantially the same as Bush leveymg Dec 2011 #162

I'll give you this one, because I believe... Modern_Matthew Dec 2011 #166

didn't expect a flick of a switch, but PatrynXX Dec 2011 #167

Besides- he cant fire any of the conservatives in his cabinet until we give him 300 Liberal Senators Dr Fate Dec 2011 #168

... Maven Dec 2011 #171

It's not just the numbers the mid-terms didn't produce. It's also the message that sent! patrice Dec 2011 #205

first of all "far left" newspeak Dec 2011 #223

Obama is the smartest man sulphurdunn Dec 2011 #169

Don't worry, if we can't lower expectations for Obama by next years election hughee99 Dec 2011 #172

If voting for him in 2008 could not change the course, why should we vote for him again? AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #176

Obama is not a LEADER. This country needs a strong ethical compass OPPOSING those who Beam Me Up Dec 2011 #179

LOL Skittles Dec 2011 #180

Ah, the difference no "unrec" can make. It will change DU forever---until they bring it back. McCamy Taylor Dec 2011 #181

At least the first dozen replies aren't different variations of . . . caseymoz Dec 2011 #197

I don't think the "unrec" was a good idea. Major Hogwash Dec 2011 #206

He clearly lied to us all about his intentions. alarimer Dec 2011 #182

Well he got his daughters a dog. Lasher Dec 2011 #184

Politifact and the ENTIRE KNOWN UNIVERSE disagree with you Number23 Dec 2011 #188

Did he not campaign on "change"? Sherman A1 Dec 2011 #185

No, but he's not even attempting to change the course, and people Luciferous Dec 2011 #187

I already cut him a break. He broke it. caseymoz Dec 2011 #194

sorry, he failed fascisthunter Dec 2011 #199

Obama agrees to two month extension of unemployment and payroll tax cuts for 60 day review of oil julian09 Dec 2011 #201

watched KO last night newspeak Dec 2011 #220

Thank you WCGreen Major Hogwash Dec 2011 #204

Ummm.... yes they did think that Gman Dec 2011 #207

We should create fake positions, argue agianst them, ZombieHorde Dec 2011 #208

No, but most Americans who voted for him thought he would at least put up a fight MadHound Dec 2011 #219

Well Said, MadHound Paladin Dec 2011 #222

I did not expect him to fix it in a short time and I recognize that the rethugs are doing everything jwirr Dec 2011 #221

Worse is his position is generally in the neighborhood of where the TeaPubliKlans TheKentuckian Dec 2011 #227

Think about this for a moment jpgray Dec 2011 #232

Exactly, if you wanted "Change" you should have voted for a candidate running on that premise. NorthCarolina Dec 2011 #233

He's doing a good job and will continue to do so. MjolnirTime Dec 2011 #239