General Discussion

joshcryer

(62,534 posts)

126. I think you underestimate capitalism.

Fri Nov 21, 2014, 07:38 PM

Nov 2014

And that's been a problem with socialist critiques for far too long. Marx is right in that capitalism is a transitional period, everyone including Marx is wrong about how to get there.

For a President to "get rid of capitalism" they would have to start nationalizing things. They could nationalize the banks, for starters, maybe, without getting impeached. From there it's a much more daunting process. Look at Wal-Mart, the epitome of a socialized corporate environment (their margins are only 5%, so they are literally a socialist hierarchy; equalize the pay for all the workers and you have a socialist microcosm). Only way to take it over and make it "more socialist" is to buy it out, that's around $300 billion. Or you could just pass legislation in Congress that taxes the top elites and mandates a higher wage for corporations, and you kill a dozen birds with one stone. But, oops, that requires Congress.

But, whatever, I'm unimaginative...

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

170 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Is Immigration really the top problem we need Obama to deal with? [View all] J_J_ Nov 2014 OP

It is if you are a child about to have both parents deported..... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #1

Not some people...same people. Nt. pkdu Nov 2014 #4

+1 MohRokTah Nov 2014 #140

The legal immigrants will now be fired, corporations like illegals for a reason J_J_ Nov 2014 #13

uh wut??? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #19

Why not go after corporations hiring illegals? What is the problem with that? J_J_ Nov 2014 #26

What would you have him do to them? Give them a time out? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #29

Shut down the business if they are hiring illegal immigrants- don't go after immigrants J_J_ Nov 2014 #34

HOW does he do that? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #36

seriously? If they are illegal, isn't it illegal to hire them? DUH! You send people to arrest them J_J_ Nov 2014 #40

and Obama knows....right....he can executive order them to JAIL!!! VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #43

There is no way to hold corporations who hire illegal workers accountable to the law? J_J_ Nov 2014 #48

Oh and Obama and his Executive Orders can fix that? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #83

No EO required, that is called enforcement of laws on the book or are you arguing it is legal TheKentuckian Nov 2014 #82

I am arguing that Obama cannot EO that out of existence....PERIOD! VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #84

What are you inventing now? When did I say anything about splitting up families? TheKentuckian Nov 2014 #123

that IS what this is fucking about.....Children BORN in the United States having their parents VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #125

I'm not against this action, my argument was that no EO is required to prosecute TheKentuckian Nov 2014 #137

Then what the hell are you talking about....you make no sense at all! VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #153

I'm talking about a nonsense point you made that Obama can't enforce illegal hiring laws. TheKentuckian Nov 2014 #167

they are already law....he VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #168

then why does this matter...its ALREADY on the books...Obama is not preventing that! VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #103

Yup, this is the enforcing the law part BUT an EO could be made to refocus enforcement TheKentuckian Nov 2014 #121

No an EO cannot do that.....You also act like the EO is a magic wand.... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #155

If the undocumented workers provide decent quality fake ID to satisfy the form I-9 requirements, amandabeech Nov 2014 #99

You talking about all those that came in planes with visas and just overstayed??? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #104

No, I'm talking about mostly Mexicans who came here without documentation amandabeech Nov 2014 #107

Oh yes all 12 million of them right? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #150

From what I've read, it's about half, but I can't vouch for the number. amandabeech Nov 2014 #154

then YOU need to show WHAT you have read..... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #156

I'm just going from memory on the number, no more, no less. n/t amandabeech Nov 2014 #159

that doesn't work around here....if you make a claim....you source it or its false... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #160

and those that came on planes "don't" get fake id's just Mexicans.....rioght! VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #151

No, I imagine that many Visa overstayers get fake IDs, too, amandabeech Nov 2014 #157

Please provide a source that 6 million "illegal immigrants" have fake Ids... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #158

You're more interested in this topic than I am. Google is your friend. n/t amandabeech Nov 2014 #161

YOU made this claim that YOU believe.....back it up...as I say Bullshit! VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #162

"Under Obama, ICE announced sanctions against major employers." pampango Nov 2014 #146

just admit what your agenda is and get it over with. Warren Stupidity Nov 2014 #130

FOX News Talks about it EVERY day for 6 years-It MUST Be. Besides, Obama addressed it in minutes. NT TheBlackAdder Nov 2014 #139

No, these people needed him to deal with it: Ykcutnek Nov 2014 #2

Nice depictive photo, Ykcutnek! Gracias~ Cha Nov 2014 #91

Huge fail, but thanks for playing. emulatorloo Nov 2014 #3

The insinuation being we can only do one thing at a time RedCappedBandit Nov 2014 #5

what is being done to help millions who are starving? J_J_ Nov 2014 #15

Well now we have a repub Congress ask them. upaloopa Nov 2014 #42

A lot. RedCappedBandit Nov 2014 #72

he acted alone on this- he can act alone again J_J_ Nov 2014 #74

What exactly can he do for the hungry and homeless, alone (ie EO), that he won't get sued for? kydo Nov 2014 #97

He's not the only one who can act on those issues, first of all, RedCappedBandit Nov 2014 #108

Take a CIVICs lesson. Learn who controls the purse strings in this government! nt TheBlackAdder Nov 2014 #141

What's the matter President Obama did not wave his magic Executive Order wand and end world VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #105

Ask the republican congress. nt. Warren Stupidity Nov 2014 #131

'Merca TBF Nov 2014 #6

Is he stopping corporations from hiring illegal immigrants? J_J_ Nov 2014 #17

Did you listen to TBF Nov 2014 #25

they need to stop going after PEOPLE, and go after the CORPORATIONS that are using/abusing them J_J_ Nov 2014 #30

Agree with you on that - TBF Nov 2014 #45

Go after corporations?.....but then he wouldn't have the time and money to help the poor in your op Sheepshank Nov 2014 #62

Obama must search every restaurant and Landscaping business by hand until EVERY employer VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #109

Stop this foolishness ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #61

Facts don't matter to pot-stirring trolls. emulatorloo Nov 2014 #79

Did you even read your link? former9thward Nov 2014 #87

Yes, I read it ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #100

That the increase was mostly do to paperwork items. former9thward Nov 2014 #128

I'm in AZ, as well ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #134

Well it depends on what the paperwork violations are. former9thward Nov 2014 #136

True. eom. 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #144

Executive orders only cover the Federal branch. joshcryer Nov 2014 #116

Where did I say I wanted to nationalize everything? TBF Nov 2014 #117

How else do you get there? joshcryer Nov 2014 #118

Here we go again ... TBF Nov 2014 #120

I think you underestimate capitalism. joshcryer Nov 2014 #126

You've convinced me - TBF Nov 2014 #133

It's a big problem Kalidurga Nov 2014 #7

Should I file this under, "nothing is ever good enough" or under "you can't do two things at once" FSogol Nov 2014 #8

Obama ate breakfast today. Ykcutnek Nov 2014 #10

Is he doing anything at all to address millions of starving people in America? J_J_ Nov 2014 #21

you do realize they ARE some of the people starving in America right? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #27

Perhaps you've heard of the SNAP Program? n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #64

Child poverty in U.S. is at highest point in 20 years, report finds J_J_ Nov 2014 #66

Okay ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #70

and Obama should use the "mighty Executive Order wand" to end poverty immediatly! VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #111

If Obama WERE an emperor, he could do this. He's not, so J_J_ is just trolling. nt TheBlackAdder Nov 2014 #142

Exactly..... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #152

Forget that prioritization...is it a VERY GOOD THING? HereSince1628 Nov 2014 #9

Unlike his predecesor who could not walk and chew a pretzel, Obama can do two things at once. nt Xipe Totec Nov 2014 #11

But HE IS NOT doing anything J_J_ Nov 2014 #22

Your concern is duly noted. nt Xipe Totec Nov 2014 #23

And how do you know this? Skidmore Nov 2014 #41

Do free trade agreements help Americans keep jobs and put food on their families? J_J_ Nov 2014 #57

You on the other hand are just so full of... solutions. nt Xipe Totec Nov 2014 #78

"HE IS NOT doing anything"? Nothing? He talked about immigration yesterday so is taking today off? uppityperson Nov 2014 #51

President Obama can not legislate (create law) or raise funds so can not create programs Agnosticsherbet Nov 2014 #12

If he can make his own path on immigration, he can stand up to the bastards and help the rest of US J_J_ Nov 2014 #58

He promised to re-negotiate NAFTA as well. amandabeech Nov 2014 #68

yes, exactly. People don't seem to want to look at the root of our problems J_J_ Nov 2014 #73

No discussion on real issues means fewer people energized to vote, too. amandabeech Nov 2014 #89

The "Bully Pulpit" is a phrase that describes a Presidents ability to sway public opinion. Agnosticsherbet Nov 2014 #124

Obama should issue an executive order to end poverty! That's what I would do. FSogol Nov 2014 #14

He allowed 8 Billion to be cut from food stamps, even as farm subsidies were increased J_J_ Nov 2014 #24

That's a total misrepresentation of the changes to food stamps and has no connection FSogol Nov 2014 #28

Well, he actually did prevent FLyellowdog Nov 2014 #85

yes. it is one of the 'top problems'. spanone Nov 2014 #16

That's a first world problem right there! demwing Nov 2014 #18

No one is doing anything about the growing number of homeless children J_J_ Nov 2014 #38

often, when a person wants to start a dialog demwing Nov 2014 #110

Yes. It's been festering for years. n/t Comrade Grumpy Nov 2014 #20

You then believe that dealing with A prevents dealing with B, C or D? LanternWaste Nov 2014 #31

dealing with A is fine, but it really wasn't the nation's top priority J_J_ Nov 2014 #55

Simply because you may be ignorant of a particular or a specific, does not in fact, make it the case LanternWaste Nov 2014 #75

I have not been given one credible solution being offered J_J_ Nov 2014 #80

you are ignoring Sheepshank Nov 2014 #32

Child poverty in U.S. is at highest point in 20 years, report finds J_J_ Nov 2014 #60

and your friendly Republican Congress Sheepshank Nov 2014 #63

Well he just did what he wanted on Immigration- He can do it again! J_J_ Nov 2014 #71

you are your faux outrage talking points are useless in this discussion Sheepshank Nov 2014 #94

Well you ARE blabbering. I'll give you that. elias49 Nov 2014 #149

ypu seem to ignore DonCoquixote Nov 2014 #166

Ffs... BeyondGeography Nov 2014 #33

What the Fuck Has Obama Done So far you ask? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #35

Not anymore. Iggo Nov 2014 #37

yes, what is next? That was my whole point! J_J_ Nov 2014 #46

Well...no, it wasn't. Iggo Nov 2014 #115

He doesn't work on one problem at a time. upaloopa Nov 2014 #39

But HE IS NOT doing anything to address millions who are starving and homeless J_J_ Nov 2014 #44

Maybe you missed this reply uppityperson Nov 2014 #52

Write to your congress critter and senator about this. HappyMe Nov 2014 #53

I guess you have a copy of his task list. upaloopa Nov 2014 #56

Who put forth an economic stimulus package. upaloopa Nov 2014 #65

It's getting worse- Obama stood up to them on immigration, why is he helpless on everything else? J_J_ Nov 2014 #77

You are just flogging a dead horse. Go outside and upaloopa Nov 2014 #81

LOL...nice try but major fail... Spazito Nov 2014 #47

Awesome cartoon. n/t FSogol Nov 2014 #50

That is awesome!! azmom Nov 2014 #76

LOL. nt Cali_Democrat Nov 2014 #135

I'm not living in poverty or a homeless child. So, no, it isn't a top problem... Drunken Irishman Nov 2014 #49

More Than 48 Million Americans Live In Poverty, Census Bureau Reports J_J_ Nov 2014 #69

There can be more than one top problem. Drunken Irishman Nov 2014 #93

Yes, it had to bubble to the top eventually Lil Missy Nov 2014 #54

that is a specious argument drray23 Nov 2014 #59

How many of those who are living in Poverty are undocumented residents working dilby Nov 2014 #67

I had a Hispanic co-worker, whose Uncle ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #86

I knew a woman who imported people from Korea and other Asian countries. bravenak Nov 2014 #113

Well, he needed to deal with it years ago. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Nov 2014 #88

Sideshow. And it's cheap. Octafish Nov 2014 #90

Yes, the people this effects live here and many have the same problems as you are talking about. jwirr Nov 2014 #92

RepublicansRZombies... SidDithers Nov 2014 #95

!!!! Spazito Nov 2014 #101

Gotta love DU's revolving door... SidDithers Nov 2014 #170

You speak from a certain side of 'we'. LawDeeDah Nov 2014 #96

I suspect Skittles Nov 2014 #98

I thought he did a good job explaining what Progressive dog Nov 2014 #102

It's one of the top problems -- so yes Algernon Moncrieff Nov 2014 #106

You want to know what are more sadoldgirl Nov 2014 #112

Yeah, fuck Obama, saving families from being split up, what an asshole randys1 Nov 2014 #114

Yeah. MurrayDelph Nov 2014 #119

Just something about him, cant put my finger on it, he is different, know what I mean? lol randys1 Nov 2014 #122

He can do more than one thing... tuhaybey Nov 2014 #127

It is an important problem and it is something the executive branch Warren Stupidity Nov 2014 #129

How about - it took him an hour to sign new rules for Customs & Border Protection... brooklynite Nov 2014 #132

Jesus Christ, Obama could cure cancer, extend life to 150 years, set up medicare for all, ... MohRokTah Nov 2014 #138

This message was self-deleted by its author Corruption Inc Nov 2014 #143

Yeah, fuck Obama, saving families from being split up, what an asshole emulatorloo Nov 2014 #163

Yes it is madokie Nov 2014 #145

Did anyone say it was? MineralMan Nov 2014 #147

Immigration reform doesn't really step on the toes of the powerful. Maedhros Nov 2014 #148

There is never just one problem a President has to work on karynnj Nov 2014 #164

Good question Android3.14 Nov 2014 #165

seems to be able to increase war spending and killing J_J_ Nov 2014 #169