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Beastly Boy

(13,087 posts)
37. Ah, thanks for bringing these passages to my attention.
Mon Jul 21, 2025, 10:16 AM
Monday

While in the past I would have considered Dr Bartov's opinion article a case of mere partisan zealotry, I am now detecting a whiff of academic dishonesty in it. He consistently misrepresents what the academics he is citing are actually saying to create false appearance of their consensus with his fringe views.

In the article by Shmuel Lederman which he cites, the author makes a clear distinction between the legal meaning of genocide, which is up to the competent international courts to rule on, and a perception of certain measures anticipated from Israeli government that would allow for interpreting its actions as genocidal (https://www.regthink.org/genocidal-intentions/).

He misquotes William Shabas, who never mentioned genocide in the cited Facebook clip (https://www.facebook.com/MiddleEastEye/videos/680386097836076/?rdid=Bt5j27n9IWEkRwG0).

The cited article by Martin Shaw doesn't go beyond, in the case of Israel, "raising questions" of "genocidal intent" (https://newlinesmag.com/spotlight/the-uses-and-abuses-of-the-term-genocide-in-gaza/).

In the cited article by Dirk Moses, the author argues that "legally speaking a genocide cannot be unilaterally declared" and such determination by parties other than competent legal venues doesn't go beyond unilateral and sentimental. He further demonstrates that Israel's actions in Gaza are by no means unique or exceptional, citing comparable conflicts where no accusations of genocide have been made (https://www.bostonreview.net/articles/more-than-genocide/)

Only one of the genocide scholars cited by Dr. Bartow, Melanie O’Brien, agrees with his opinion, and it appears that the organization she heads doesn't share it (https://genocidescholars.org/)

Contrary to Dr Bartov's claims, there is no consensus even within the small group of genocide scholars he carefully selected to misrepresent agreement with his partisan opinions, let alone the wider community of genocide scholars. Add to it the aforementioned "rift between genocide scholars and Holocaust scholars", and the picture of Dr Bartow's isolation from the mainstream majority of scholars becomes undeniable, no matter how hard he, or his fans, try to conceal it.

Recommendations

1 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

K & R Celerity Thursday #1
"The Holy Land" Skittles Thursday #2
The author is not wrong irisblue Thursday #3
I am not a genocide scholar but I know genocide malaise Thursday #4
K & R democrank Thursday #5
I haven't seen any... druidity33 Thursday #6
And you will see even fewer of them. I found it utterly useless to counter opinions with facts. Beastly Boy Thursday #11
Nah. When neither facts nor morality are on your side, I'd be quiet too. AloeVera Sunday #24
Facts are on my side allright. I keep citing them again and again. Beastly Boy Sunday #29
With facts such as the ADL got canceled its a wonder anyone can even think of debating you. Eko Sunday #31
Ten minutes later, and your post didn't age well, did it? Beastly Boy Sunday #32
Mine aged very well. Eko Sunday #34
I see you are a big fan of rapid aging. Beastly Boy Sunday #35
I can tell you that I am not a fan of using right wing slogans. Eko Monday #36
It's not genocide. nt LexVegas Thursday #13
Some of those same people are saying ethnic cleansing isn't taking place, either Rob H. Thursday #18
It's an academic argument... druidity33 Thursday #19
K&R spanone Thursday #7
The author admits that he is offering an opinion that is contrary to most other sources Beastly Boy Thursday #8
Why let that get in the way of the "concern"? nt LexVegas Thursday #9
Haaretz has some facts too BeyondGeography Thursday #12
And these facts are consistent with urban warfare involving human shields, not genocide. Beastly Boy Thursday #14
Haaretz has reported extensively on the IDF's use of Palestinians as human shields BeyondGeography Thursday #16
And your point is... what? Beastly Boy Thursday #17
You didn't read the article too closely, or something. AloeVera Sunday #22
Ah, thanks for bringing these passages to my attention. Beastly Boy Monday #37
Gee, who should I listen to? A genocide expert or an "emotional healing" blogger? AloeVera Sunday #23
Gaza 2035: A Beacon of Peace and Prosperity in the Flourishing Middle East by Seth Eisenberg - cliffside Sunday #25
Unbelievable. AloeVera Sunday #28
Spinmeister sounds right to me! "Donald Tump Square" :( nt cliffside Sunday #30
Between the two, the 'emotional healing" blogger appears to be more trustworthy and objective. Beastly Boy Monday #38
Domicide should be listed as a war crime too when it's this widespread uponit7771 Thursday #10
Especially when it's domicide in aid of ethnic cleansing. AloeVera Sunday #21
Omer Bartov is an incredible man and scholar I have been reading and listening to for years. His book, Nanjeanne Thursday #15
Kicked and recommended Uncle Joe Thursday #20
Bookmarked underpants Sunday #26
Thanks for sharing the full article! Below is an interview from 7/17 ... cliffside Sunday #27
Netanyahu - Trump - Putin - it's all connnected. Initech Sunday #33
Genocides have a long history. The roots always seem to be based in nationalism religion, and fear. Ping Tung Monday #39
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»I'm a Genocide Scholar. I...»Reply #37